FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in 
WTC South Tower - Wrong Tower Fell First
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Next Level Forum Index -> 9/11 HardCorps Specifics Investigation
  ::  Previous topic :: Next topic  
Author Message
DeepLogos



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 259
Location: Geostationary orbit around myself, sipping at a cup of DM Tea...

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

WTC 1 & 2 occupants:

Quote:
North Tower (Tower 1):

Floor 110
Channel WPIX, WCBS, WBIS, WNJU, WNYW, CNN Satellite Dishes & Antennas Cable/Television
Floor 109
Floor 108
Floor 107
World Trade Club
Greatest Bar on Earth
Floor 106
Windows on the World
Floor 105

Cantor Fitzgerald Securities

Investments
Floor 104
Channel 4 (NBC) Cable/Television
Cantor Fitzgerald Securities Investments
Floor 103
Cantor Fitzgerald Securities Investments
Floor 102
Cantor Fitzgerald Securities Investments
The Nishi-Nippon Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 101
Cantor Fitzgerald Securities Investments
Kidder Peabody & Co.
Floor 100
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 99
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 98
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 97
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 96
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 95
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 94
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Floor 93
Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Fred Alger Management Investments
Floor 92
Carr Futures
Floor 91
American Bureau of Shipping Engineering
Floor 90
The Chugoku Bank, Ltd. Financial Institutions
American TCC Int'l Group Investments
Floor 89
Drinker Biddle & Reath Attorneys
Mutual International Forwarding Transportation
Strategic Communications Telecommunication
Wai Gao Qiao USA Business Consultants
Wall Street Planning
Metropolitan Life Insurance Insurance Agencies
CIIC Group, Ltd. Investments
Daehan International Investments
Broad USA Wholesalers
Floor 88

Floor 87
May Davis Group Investments
Floor 86
Trading Technologies Software
Julien J. Studley, Inc. Real Estate
Floor 85
Thermo Electron
SMW Trading Corp. Investments
Floor 84
KITC Investments
Unicom Capital Advisors Investments
Temenos USA, Inc. Wholesalers
San-In Godo Bank Ltd. Financial Institutions
LG Securities America, Inc. Investments
David Peterson Attorneys
Bright China Capital, Ltd. Investments
Floor 83
General Telecommunications
Taipei Bank Financial Institutions
Lava Trading
Global Crossings Holdings Computer Services
eMeritus Communications Telecommunication
Floor 82
NY Metro Transportation Government school
Floor 81
New Continental Enterprises Transportation
Network Plus Telecommunication
Bank of America Financial Institutions
Floor 80
Noga Commodities Overseas, Inc. Investments
The Beast.Com Computer Services
RLI Insurance Company Insurance Agencies
Shizuoka Bank Ltd. Financial Institutions
Agricor Commodities Corp. Investments
Intrust Investment Realty
Floor 79
First Liberty Investment Group Investments
Okato Shoji Company, Ltd. Computer Services
Securant Technologies Computer Services
Nikko Securities Financial Institutions
International Office Centers Business Services
Daynard & Van Thunen Co. Insurance Agencies
Floor 78
Hyundai Securities Co. Investments
Korea Local Authorities Foundation Government
ThinkPath Employment Agencies
Geiger & Geiger Attorneys
Cheng Cheng Enterprises Holding Inc Retailers
Geiger & Geiger Law Firms
Traders Access Center Investments
Pacrim Trading & Shipping Transportation
Cedar Capital Management Associates
Meridian Ventures Holding
International Trade Center Public Relations
Baltic Oil Corporation
Avenir, Inc. Computer Services
Floor 77
World Trade Centers Association Organizations
Jun He Law Office Attorneys
New-ey International Corp. Business Services
Martin Progressive Computer Services
Hal Roth Agency Insurance Agencies
Floor 76

Floor 75

Floor 74

Floor 73

Floor 72

Floor 71

Floor 70

Floor 69

Floor 68

Floor 67

Floor 66

Floor 65

Floor 64

Floor 63
Airport Access Program Financial Institutions
Floor 62

Floor 61

Floor 60
Asahi Bank, Ltd. Financial Institutions
Floor 59
Sidley Austin, Brown & Wood Attorneys
Floor 58

Floor 57

Floor 56
Sidley Austin, Brown & Wood Attorneys
Floor 55
World Trade Institute
Pace University Government schools
Floor 54
Sidley Austin, Brown & Wood Attorneys
Floor 53
Natural Nydegger Transport Transportation
China Resource Products
Pacrim Trading & Shipping Transportation
Pure Energy Corp. Wholesalers
LoCurto & Funk, Inc. Investments
Keenan Powers & Andrews Attorneys
Bank of Taiwan Financial Institutions
A I G Aviation Brokerage Insurance Agencies
Floor 52
Hill Betts & Nash Attorneys
Temenos USA Wholesalers
The Williams Capital Group
RGL Gallagher PC Accountants
Richard A. Zimmerman Attorneys
Leeds & Morrelli Attorneys
Okasan International Investments
Howly Corporation
Gayer Shyu & Wiesel Investments
Bramax Manufacturing Wholesalers
Floor 51
C & P Press Business Services
AT&T Corporation Telecommunication
Floor 50
Dai-Ichi Kangyo Trust Co. Trusts
Floor 49
Dai-Ichi Kangyo Trust Co. Trusts
Floor 48
Dai-Ichi Kangyo Trust Co. Trusts
Floor 47
G. Z. Stephens Employment Agencies
Quint Amasis Business Services
W.J. Export-Import Wholesalers
Pacific American Co. Wholesalers
American TCC Int'l Group Investments
Floor 46
Meganet Management Consultants Computer Services
Suggested Open Systems Computer Services
Suntendy America Wholesalers
T&T Enterprises Int.l Miscellaneous
Prospect International
Blue Sky Technologies Computer Services
Sinopec USA Wholesalers
Kanebo Information Systems Corp. Computer Services
J & X Tans International Transportation
Yong Ren America
Auto Imperial Co. Wholesalers
Dahao USA Corp Wholesalers
ASTDC, Inc. Organizations
Floor 45
China Construction Construction
Pure Energy Corp. Wholesalers
Dunavant Commodity Investments
Security Traders Assoc. Organizations
M.A. Katz, CPA Accountants
Fertitta Enterprises
The Company Store Retailers
Sassoons
Employee Merit Employment Agencies
Streamline Capital
SRA
American Lota International Transportation
Floor 44
NFA/GGG, Inc.
N.Y. Society of Security Government school
Floor 43
Mechanical Floor
Floor 42
Mechanical Floor
Floor 41
Mechanical Floor
Floor 40
Lehman Brothers Financial Institutions
Floor 39
Lehman Brothers Financial Institutions
Tai Fook Securities Investments
The Cultural Institutions Retirement Systems Trusts
Xcel Federal Credit Union Financial Institutions
Overseas Union Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 38
Turner Construction Co. Construction
Regional Alliance Small Contractors Construction
Lehman Brothers Financial Institutions
Floor 37
Government of Thailand
Commodity Futures Trading Commission Investments
Floor 36
Kemper Insurance Companies Insurance Agencies
Floor 35
Kemper Insurance Companies Insurance Agencies
Data Transmission Network
Law Office of Anne Pope Attorneys
Floor 34

Floor 33
China Daily Distribution Corp. Business Services
MANAA Trading Group Investments
Data Transmission Network
Koudis International Transportation/Utilities
Serko & Simon Attorneys
Rachel & Associates Manufacturing
Hu Tong International Co. Wholesalers
Golden King Limited Transportation
MIS Service Co.
Berel & Mullen Attorneys
Floor 32
Rohde & Liesenfeld Transportation
Chang HWA Commercial Bank Financial Institutions
Banco LatinoAmericano de Exportaciones Financial Institutions
Floor 31
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Port Authority of NY & NJ Government
Floor 30

Floor 29
World Travel Travel Agencies
China Patent & Trademark Attorneys
Floor 28
Port Authority of NY & NJ Government
Floor 27
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Floor 26
Garban Intercapital Investments
Floor 25
R.H. Wrightson & Assoc. Investments
Geiger & Geiger Law Firms
Garban Intercapital Investments
Floor 24
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Port Authority of NY & NJ Government
Floor 23
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Floor 22
Cheng Xiang Trading USA Computer Services
Tai Fook Securities Investments
MLU Investment
The SCPIE Companies
Kaiser Overseas Inc. Manufacturing
Karoon Capital Management Investments
P. Wolfe Consultants Business Consultants
Gold Sky Inc. Manufacturing
Unicom Capital Advisors Investments
G.C. Services Collection Agencies
Chicago Options Exchange Corp. Investments
Floor 21
United Seamen's Service Social Services
Continental Logistics. Business Services
Tower Computer Service Retailers
Friends Ivory & Sime Investments
Friends Villas Fischer Trust Investments
Lief International USA Manufacturing
Infotech
Roman V. Popik Attorneys
Dr. Tadasu Tokumaru Medical Doctors
Dongwon Securities Co. Investments
Avesta Computer Services, Data Processing
Floor 20
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Floor 19
Port Authority of NY & NJ Government
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Floor 18

Floor 17
Zim-American Israeli Shipping Co. Transportation
Empire Health Choice Insurance Agencies
Floor 16
Zim-American Israeli Shipping Co. Transportation
California Bank & Trust Financial Institutions
Floor 15
Landmark Education Corporation Government
Floor 14
Port Authority of NY & NJ Government
Instinet, Inc. Investments
Dun & Bradstreet Research
Floor 13
Instinet, Inc. Investments
Floor 12

Floor 11
Porcella Vicini & Co. Transportation
Primarch Decision Economics Business Consultants
Bank of America Financial Institutions
Floor 10

Floor 9
Bank of America Financial Institutions
Floor 8
Amerson Group Co., Inc. Organizations
Floor 7
Thai Farmers Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 6

Floor 5
Gayer, Shyu & Wiesel Accountants
Floor 4
Geiger & Geiger Law Firms
Floor 3
Port Authority of NY & NJ Government
Floor 2

Floor 1
Strawberry Retailers
Ann Taylor Loft Retailers
Avis
Olympia Airport Express
Delta Airlines
Link: http://www.sadnews.net/CTZ/0Mem/20010911/WTCN1.htm

According to World Trade Aftermath: http://worldtradeaftermath.com/wta/wtc_info/tenants_by_floor_wtc1.asp


Quote:
South Tower (Tower 2):
Floor 110

Floor 109
Floor 108
Floor 107
Showtime Pictures Business Services
Floor 106
Atlantic Bank of New York Financial Institutions
Floor 105

Floor 104
Sandler O'Neill & Partners Investments
Floor 103

Floor 102

Floor 101

Floor 100
AON Corporation Insurance Agencies
Floor 99
AON Corporation Insurance Agencies
Floor 98

Floor 97
Fiduciary Trust Company International Financial Institutions
Floor 96
Fiduciary Trust Company International Financial Institutions
Floor 95
Fiduciary Trust Company International Financial Institutions
Floor 94
Fiduciary Trust Company International Financial Institutions
Floor 93
Regus Business Centers Employment Agencies
Floor 92
AON Corporation Insurance Agencies
Floor 91
The Washington Group
Raytheon Company Manufacturing
Gibbs & Hill Engineers
Floor 90
Fiduciary Trust Company International Financial Institutions
Floor 89
Keefe, Bruyette & Woods Investments
Floor 88
Keefe, Bruyette & Woods Investments
Floor 87
NY State Department of Taxation & Finance Government
Corporation Service Company
Floor 86
NY State Department of Taxation & Finance Government
Floor 85
Harris Beach & Wilcox, Attorneys
Keefe, Bruyette & Woods Investments
Floor 84
bepaid.com
Floor 83

Floor 82
Fuji Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 81
Fuji Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 80
Fuji Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 79
Fuji Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 78
First Commercial Bank Financial Institutions
Floor 77

Floor 76

Floor 75

Floor 74
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 73

Floor 72

Floor 71

Floor 70

Floor 69

Floor 68

Floor 67

Floor 66

Floor 65

Floor 64

Floor 63

Floor 62

Floor 61

Floor 60

Floor 59
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 58
Dow Jones & Co. Publishers
Floor 57
Dow Jones & Co. Publishers
Floor 56
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 55
Garban Intercapital
Floor 54
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Floor 53
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Floor 52
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Floor 51
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Floor 50
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Floor 49
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Seabury & Smith Insurance Agencies
Floor 48
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Fireman's Fund Insurance Company Insurance Agencies
Floor 47
Guy Carpenter Insurance Agencies
Floor 46
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 45
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 44
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 43
Morgan Stanley Investments
Floor 42
Mechanical Floor
Floor 41
Mechanical Floor
Floor 40
Thacher, Proffitt & Wood Attorneys
Sitailong International USA
Floor 39
Thacher, Proffitt & Wood Attorneys
Floor 38
Thacher, Proffitt & Wood Attorneys
Floor 37

Floor 36
Frenkel & Company Insurance Agencies
Floor 35
Frenkel & Company Insurance Agencies
Floor 34
Oppenheimer Funds Investments
Floor 33
Oppenheimer Funds Investments
Floor 32
Commerzbank Capital Markets Investments
Oppenheimer Funds Investments
Floor 31
Oppenheimer Funds Investments
Floor 30
New York Stock Exchange
Hartford Steam Boiler Insurance Agencies
Floor 29
New York Stock Exchange
Weatherly Securities Corp. Investments
Floor 28
New York Stock Exchange
Law Office of Joseph Bellard Attorneys
Big A Travel Agency Travel Agencies/Tours
Hua Nan Commercial Bank Banks/Financial Institutions
Dempsey, Myers & Company CPA firm
Floor 27

Floor 26
Sun Microsystems Computer Services
Floor 25
Sun Microsystems Computer Services
Floor 24
TD Waterhouse Group Investments
December First Productions
Globe Tour & Travel Travel Agencies
Allstate Insurance Company Insurance Agencies
Sinolion USA
China Chamber of Commerce Organizations
SCOR U.S. Corporation Insurance Agencies
Floor 23
SCOR U.S. Corporation Insurance Agencies
Unistrat Corporation of America Business Consultants
Floor 22
Antal International Employment Agencies
Mancini Duffy Architects
Sinochem American Holdings Investments
Washington Mutual, Inc.
Floor 21
Charoen Pokphand USA Transportation
Adecco SA Employment Agencies
Career Engine Research
Mancini Duffy Architects
Floor 20
Thacher, Proffitt & Wood Attorneys
N.Y. Shipping Association Transportation
Floor 19
N.Y. Shipping Association Transportation
Waterfront Commission of New York Harbor Government
Floor 18
Showtime Pictures Business Services
Chen, Lin, Li, & Jiang, LLP Investments
Professional Assistance & Consulting Business Consultants
Pines Investment
Abad, Castilla & Mallonga Attorneys
Intera Group Inc. Employment Agencies
Caserta & Company
Weiland International Investments
Alliance Consulting Business Consultants
Floor 17
N.Y. Institute of Finance Business Consultants
Floor 16
National Development & Research Institute Research
Floor 15
John W. Loofbourrow Associates Investments
Orient International
Mancini Duffy Architects
John J. McMullen Associates Engineers
James T. Ratner, Law Office of Attorneys
Candia Shipping Wholesalers
Floor 14
Union Bank of California International Financial Institutions
Charna Chemicals, Inc. Manufacturing
Paging Network of New York Telecommunication
Patinka International Business Services
Floor 13

Floor 12
Verizon Communications Telecommunication
EuroBrokers, Inc. Investments
Floor 11
Verizon Communications Telecommunication
Floor 10
Verizon Communications Telecommunication
Floor 9
Verizon Communications Telecommunication
Floor 8

Floor 7

Floor 6

Floor 5

Floor 4

Floor 3

Floor 2

Floor 1
Colortek Kodak Imaging Center :Business Services
Johnston & Murphy
Nichols Foundation :Government/Schools
Xerox Document Company
at Basement :Manufacturing
Link: http://www.sadnews.net/CTZ/0Mem/20010911/WTCS2.htm

According to WorldTrade Afermath: http://worldtradeaftermath.com/wta/wtc_info/tenants_by_floor_wtc2.asp


Further info can also be found at: http://worldtradeaftermath.com/wta/wtc_info/ (including tenants of the other buildings).

This is what I could find as to occupants of the two towers. It seems to be a semi-complete list if some floors weren't vacant? There are some difference between the two sources.

North tower; floors impacted by crash; 94-99; Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Directly above: Cantor Fitzgerald Securities Investments,
Kidder Peabody & Co and Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Directly below: Marsh USA, Inc. Insurance Co.
Fred Alger Management Investments

South tower; floors impacted by crash; 78-84; First Commercial Bank Financial Institutions, Fuji Bank Financial Institutions, bepaid.com
Directly above: Harris Beach & Wilcox, Attorneys Keefe,
Bruyette & Woods Investments (86th floor: NY State Department of Taxation & Finance Government)
Directly below: Vacant?

Sources for impact zones: NFPA
http://www.civil.usyd.edu.au/latest/aibs_2002_wtc.pdf#search=%22impact%20zones%20wtc%22

Fiduciary Trust was one of the first to move into the south tower when it was erected. They lost 86 employees, but not their CEO Anne Tatlock who was in Omaha that day (charity with Warren "Oracle of Omaha" Buffet. I know Forbes reported on the 15th of October 2001 that the planes hit where Fiduciary Trust had their offices. This is not correct.

(I will update later when I find more related info)

-DL-

_________________
"I'm pulling the plug on you now, Jmmanuel... I hope your resurrection ship is nearby..."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
DeepLogos



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 259
Location: Geostationary orbit around myself, sipping at a cup of DM Tea...

PostPosted: Sat Aug 26, 2006 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting as to WTC generally (cursory):

Port Authority in February 2000 wrote:
NEWS
World Trade Center

22-00: FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE , February 14, 2000

PORT AUTHORITY'S WORLD TRADE CENTER WINS REGIONAL AWARD, QUALIFIES FOR 'BEST IN THE WORLD' COMPETITION


The World Trade Center has won the prestigious Middle Atlantic Regional Building of the Year Award, qualifying it to compete this summer for the title of "Best in the World," Port Authority Executive Director Robert E. Boyle announced today.

The award follows a major series of improvements by the Port Authority to key elements of the office complex, including its retail mall, five-acre outdoor plaza and such important building services as electrical and elevator operations. Occupancy is at an all-time high - approximately 94 percent.

The Port Authority's enhancements recently won the building the coveted designation as Middle Atlantic Regional Building of the Year. The award will be presented at an awards ceremony on April 28 at the Copacabana in Manhattan.

The award qualifies the Trade Center for the International Office Building of the Year competition. Winners of the international competition will be announced June 17-20 in San Diego, Calif.

The Office Building of the Year Award - created in 1985 - is the most prestigious and comprehensive program of its kind in the commercial real estate industry, recognizing quality in office buildings and in office building management.

The Trade Center recently won the sought-after Operating Office Building of the Year Award from the Building Owners and Managers Association of New York.

The Trade Center, which consists of two 110-story office towers, four other office buildings and a 22-story hotel, has undergone several recent improvements. They are:

· A $12 million renovation of the five-acre Austin J. Tobin Plaza, located outside the main entrances to the twin towers. Last summer, the Port Authority sponsored a series of free performances on the plaza that drew 250,000 spectators to more than 70 free performances and plans to add new cultural events this summer.

· A dramatic revitalized mall at the World Trade Center with many new shops and restaurants - more than 80 in all. Retailers reported a 26-percent increase in sales last summer.

· An electrical upgrade program to satisfy the projected power requirements of its tenants.

· Comprehensive customer service training for the World Trade Center staff. Trade Center employees attend classes in facility management, ranging from business ethics to customer relations and communications skills.


Could "additional" upgrades have been made as well, if you get my drift? Wink

-DL-

_________________
"I'm pulling the plug on you now, Jmmanuel... I hope your resurrection ship is nearby..."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Fintan
Site Admin


Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 6098

PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 4:24 pm    Post subject: WTC Site Photos - September 13th 2001 Reply with quote

Here's a great set of close-up photos of the World Trade Center site,
reportedly taken on September 13th. I have mirrored them on the
BreakForNews server so we have a permanent copy.

A useful resource for figuring out what happened.

Quote:
Sample Pic 1


Sample Pic 2


ALL FULL SIZE PHOTOS:

Photos A: World Trade Center September 13th 2001
http://www.breakfornews.com/offsitearchive/World_Trade_Center_September_13_2001_A.htm

Photos B: World Trade Center September 13th 2001
http://www.breakfornews.com/offsitearchive/World_Trade_Center_September_13_2001_B.htm

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
DeepLogos



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 259
Location: Geostationary orbit around myself, sipping at a cup of DM Tea...

PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2006 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Some really "great" WTC photos here, including panorama shots.

http://www.conservationtech.com/MAIN-TOPICS/5-NYC-World-Trade/WTC-Home.htm

Should these be mirrored as well perhaps? Some are rather large (panoramas).

-DL-

_________________
"I'm pulling the plug on you now, Jmmanuel... I hope your resurrection ship is nearby..."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Fintan
Site Admin


Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 6098

PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 8:01 am    Post subject: 9/11 Design lessons Reply with quote

Quote:
Lessons of 9/11 Alter Skyscraper Design

By DAVID B. CARUSO Associated Press Writer

September 6, 2006, 3:02 AM EDT

....Even as ash from the World Trade Center still swirled, it was clear that the high floors of the twin towers had been a deadly trap. Experts wondered if anyone would ever build tall again......

Architects, engineers and builders have split over the value of several possible safety enhancements, including better fireproofing, wider stairwells, and "hardened" elevator shafts that could be used in evacuations.......

No architects are designing their buildings to withstand a jet aircraft's impact.

"To do something like that, you wouldn't want to live in that building. It would be like a fortress. It would be so ungainly looking," Kohn said.
Link
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
DeepLogos



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 259
Location: Geostationary orbit around myself, sipping at a cup of DM Tea...

PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:06 am    Post subject: WTC, Port Authority, Rockefeller and the WTC architect Reply with quote

A Joshua Leinsdorf article about the WTC, the Port Authority, Nelson Rockefeller and the WTC architect.... Here >>
----------
BTW, this was Peter Eisenman's WTC suggestion (post 9/11-2001)



Well, it doesn't look like it is designed to take the impact of an airliner, it looks like it's about to collapse...

http://www.thecityreview.com/nytimdes.html

-DL-

_________________
"I'm pulling the plug on you now, Jmmanuel... I hope your resurrection ship is nearby..."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Continuity



Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1662
Location: Municipal Flat Block 18A, Linear North

PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 11:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

DL said:
Quote:
Well, it doesn't look like it is designed to take the impact of an airliner, it looks like it's about to collapse...

Yeah - it's the new way - rather than having buildings around that make ppl want to damage them and blow them up, and stuff, you reverse-psychologise them by making the buildings pre-fucked-up, and thus protecting them further harm. It's all the rage in modern construction circles, I'm told. (by Billy Meier's arm specialist)

_________________
The rule for today.
Touch my tail, I shred your hand.
New rule tomorrow.

Cat Haiku
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
bornfree



Joined: 28 Jan 2006
Posts: 509

PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2006 12:35 pm    Post subject: Re: WTC, Port Authority, Rockefeller and the WTC architect Reply with quote

[quote="DeepLogos"]A Joshua Leinsdorf article about the WTC, the Port Authority, Nelson Rockefeller and the WTC architect.... [url=http://www.leinsdorf.com/worldtradecenter.htm]Here >>[/url]
----------
BTW, this was Peter Eisenman's WTC suggestion (post 9/11-2001)

[img]http://www.thecityreview.com/nytdes3.gif[/img]

Well, it doesn't [i]look[/i] like it is designed to take the impact of an airliner, it looks like it's about to [i]collapse[/i]...

http://www.thecityreview.com/nytimdes.html

-DL-[/quote]

perhaps its meant to confuse future pilots as to exactly where to aim the plane? ...missle, pod, hologram
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rumpl4skn



Joined: 11 Feb 2006
Posts: 2848
Location: 36� 3'N x 86�40'W

PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Design for the WTC was provided by Minoru Yamasaki & Assoc. Emery Roth & Sons served as the architect of record. Since these people have nothing to hide, they should provide the blueprints of the WTC, for all to see. This will quell any misunderstanding regarding the facts of the collapse to be established and corrected. In fact, both companies should put the entire set of plans on the internet.
_________________
"No matter what happens, ever... there's ALWAYS at least one reason. And the top reason is ALWAYS money."
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website AIM Address Yahoo Messenger
DeepLogos



Joined: 01 Jun 2006
Posts: 259
Location: Geostationary orbit around myself, sipping at a cup of DM Tea...

PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2006 3:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rumpl4skn wrote:
Design for the WTC was provided by Minoru Yamasaki & Assoc. Emery Roth & Sons served as the architect of record. Since these people have nothing to hide, they should provide the blueprints of the WTC, for all to see. This will quell any misunderstanding regarding the facts of the collapse to be established and corrected. In fact, both companies should put the entire set of plans on the internet.


Amen to that! The entire complex (7 WTC too - even the command center).

-DL-

_________________
"I'm pulling the plug on you now, Jmmanuel... I hope your resurrection ship is nearby..."

Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
dilbert_g
Guest





PostPosted: Sat Sep 23, 2006 7:52 pm    Post subject: Some basic logic IMO Reply with quote

Some basics as I see them:

Assuming this diagram is correct
Then IF the building were to weaken due to crash and fire, it would have toppled towards that corner.

Instead, it collapsed symmetrically, all the way down, as if the opposite corners were equally damaged. I think that's equally powerful as "the wrong building fell first" -- though that seems true as well, shit happens sometimes. One person gets shot 10 times and lives, another gets a slight whack on the head and dies instantly.

Quote:
The fires are irrelevant to the destruction of the towers - this has been more than well-established. Smouldering would be a more accurate desription, anyway.

Yes.

The main support structure of 47 super-thick steel columns in the center, a Core arranged in a box matrix, trussed together and branching out like a web to the outer walls, surrounded by elevators and offices, was almost completely untouched in the South Tower --- and I'd guess 90% undamaged Core in the North Tower.

Look what happened when Flight 77 hit steel and concrete. No more contiguous plane. Should we assume that in NYC the core was damaged instead of the plane? I doubt it. And if it had, I think that would have been evident immediately, not after a smoldering fire "worked on it" for an hour.

The outer parts of the building were alleged to have had some "load-bearing" capabilities, per various experts, but a glance at the design showed that the MAIN load-bearing structure was the Core. Am I incorrect about this?

The "hollow-core" was a stupid PR meme. It's like saying every suspension bridge in the world is held up by string and fairy angels, instead of huge pylons driven (and cemented?) into the earth, from which super thick cables are hung. Suspension bridges just look like they are floating in air, held up by "nothing".

The "hollow-core" was in fact built like a brick shithouse -- no, stronger than a mere brick shithouse, a marvel of engineering of counterbalanced beams and trusses. Brick shithouses are not built to withstand planes flying into them.


Whatever can be said about the implausibility of covering up "remote control", via gag orders, via trusting an internal team to carry this out for "the future of America" and "the wonderfulness of a war for global domination on behalf of the interests of Finance Capital" (quo bono), which Brzezinski and PNAC describe at length via shrouded euphemisms, put yourself in the shoes of these Pentagon/CIA Black Ops specialists: would you leave the results of such an operation to chance? Would you trust "Mohammed Atta" to be willing to DIE, and capable of suicide up to the last second? What if they chicken out and missed, or landed the plane instead?

Look what happened in 1993. John Michael Anticev of the FBI and his "informant" Emad Ali Salem trusted those "terrorists". All the stupid ass patsies had to do was drive the freakin Ryder truck (that FBI provided) into the WTC basement and park it RIGHT NEXT TO THE FREAKIN' COLUMNS, like Salem told them (like FBI told him). Set the timer and go.

Look what happens when you trust Arab amateur-terrorists to carry out simple instructions on an important mission. They failed. They screwed up by parking it too far away, and Bill Clinton had to put up with long delays on his War on Terror, he did not even get to pass his pre-PATRIOT Act.
They had to do a repeat in OKC before he could rip the Constitution to shreds (partially), prior to Bush taking it a step further.


After "Arab terrorists" goofed up one time, do you trust them again? No, you eliminate risk of failure.


I think Guiliani's enough of a Bush insider (and seemingly TOTALLY on script throughout), I see no reason to exclude him from the operation. Fascists don't mind of their colleagues get killed, if it's for "a good cause", worthy sacrifice. That's not to say he was in it for sure, but I don't see any strong reason to exclude him. BushCo NEEDED Guiliani to play his role as the "strong mayor" fighting terror, terrorism, and terrorterrorterrorterrorterrorterror.

Designing a building with demolition explosives built-in, that's kind of like letting rattlesnakes loose in the house to protect against robbers. Implausible as a normal design feature (if so, is EVERY tall building in the last 30 years built with explosives inside and it's a secret?). I think a building is easy enough to demolish by planting explosives. (Possibly they engineered in "nooks and crannies" in which explosives could be planted at some future date, rather than having to drill and bust concrete to plant them.)

I imagine that the building maintenance areas where wiring, ethernet, plumbing, and such is placed is separate from the office areas. Tenants might see a few maintenance contractors going in and out (as reported, the alarm system had been shut off for maintenance of the network or electrical systems the prior week or so), but maintenance crews in the hallways would cause no one any alarm. You see that all the time.

What about "house" maintenance people? Would they talk? Maybe the whole maint. team was "outsourced". Did Securacom (Jeb's company) outsource maintenance too?

I dont know, but it's very plausible hypothesis. SOMEHOW explosives had to be put into place. The Towers HELD after the impact. The fires were crap and were almost out. Something else had to cause the collapse.

The difference between some speculative MAX temp. that the thick steel beams could have possibley reached in an hour (I thought Kevin Ryan said tests showed 650°), vs. the MIN temp. necessary to to melt (soften) the steel core (symmetrically) sufficiently to bring about collapse (symmetrical), to me this conclusively rules out jet fuel as a primary or secondary cause of collapse. This must mean that something else -- C4, nuclear, soundwave, some other exotic tool by Tesla, fast-moving heat-resistant concrete termites -- was needed to bring them down. And to me, it does not matter specifically what, in terms of forming a flawless argument for Joe Public.

(See, not THERMATE Mr. Jones, radioactive concrete termites, like Spiderman!)

I'll add this: While it's technically feasible that someone could have shot JFK with "Oswald's" rifle, and supposedly they finally found someone who could after 40 years, it's a huge stretch to say that proves Oswald did, esp since he reportedly could not hit rabbits. Nor anyone else from that implausible window. No honest person sticks with the least likely long shot when a much more plausible and proveable account exists -- that members of FBI, CIA, Mafia, Operation 40, and the entire Op Mockingbird media complex (international, incl. New Zealand) were involved.

Looking at the list of tenants:
What the War on Iraq proves:
Fascists have no problem with killing 3000, 6000, 130,000 "useless eaters" for anything they can justify as a worthwhile abstract goal.
Back to top
Continuity



Joined: 16 Jul 2006
Posts: 1662
Location: Municipal Flat Block 18A, Linear North

PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2006 7:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gary said:
Quote:
....fast-moving heat-resistant concrete termites....

ROFLMAO! Laughing

That's what I love about this board, even the really informative posts are commonly capable of raising a belly-laugh.

_________________
The rule for today.
Touch my tail, I shred your hand.
New rule tomorrow.

Cat Haiku
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Hocus Locus



Joined: 22 Sep 2006
Posts: 847
Location: Lost in anamnesis, cannot forget my way out

PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Fintan: Meanwhile, one reason put forward for the early collapse of WTC2 was that the firefighters had gotten to the lower of the damaged tower floors. That development sealed the immediate demise of the tower.


I alighted on this mental page some weeks back... I found the timing of transmissions of firefighters in the South Tower to be particularly interesting:

Code:
   [9:52am]
   "Battalion  Seven  ...  Ladder  15,  we've got two isolated
   pockets of fire. We should be able to knock it down with two lines.
   Radio that, 78th floor numerous 10-45 Code Ones [dead people]."
   Ladder 15: "What stair are you in, Orio?"
   Battalion Seven Aide: "Seven Alpha to lobby command post."
   Ladder Fifteen: "Fifteen to Battalion Seven."
   Battalion Seven Chief: "... Ladder 15."
   Ladder 15: "Chief, what stair you in?"
   Battalion Seven Chief: "South stairway Adam, South Tower."
   Ladder 15: "Floor 78?"
   Battalion  Seven  Chief:  "Ten-four, numerous civilians, we gonna need
   two engines up here."

[9:58am]
   Ladder 15 OV: "Stuck in the elevator, in the elevator shaft,
   you're going to have to get a different elevator. We're chopping through
   the wall to get out."

[9:59:05am] SOUTH TOWER COLLAPSE BEGINS

In Tower One, with no elevators in service, firefighters were still little more than halfway up when the 'mayday' call went out to evacuate; the last survivors out had started down from the ~43rd floor. Some were above, or disregarded the call.

But in Tower Two 'Battilion Seven', having gained a 40 floor head start via a freight elevator that worked after the building was hit at 9:03, had reached floor 78, just under the impact point... he describes 'isolated pockets' of fire. He had or would have reached in minutes, the imact level, the level in which the first artifacts -- some say 'explosive artifacts' -- of collapse were observed.

'Ladder 15 OV', also in Tower Two is (to my knowledge) the only firefighter to gain access to the top of an elevator car, the only one that had been working. His last stated intention was to punch through the sheetrock shaft wall... which would have likely given him an opportunity to observe part of the building's steel box girder core structure. Such as it was on 9/11.

Seasoned firefighters are trained to recognize and identify explosives. Explosives seen is sure to elicit an urgent and different response to mere 'explosions heard'.

If one was holding a button in one's hand, aware that the steel core was rigged with cutting charges (or the whatever core had visible nasty somethings) ... or as regards the fellow above, the impact floor contained things that might be out of place... upon hearing that last radio transmission, which was audible to many responders in the area, I feel one would have a sudden desire to push it, right then.

Just seconds later... *if* someone with a button was listening, maybe someone did. "Cover Fires implausibly 'approachable'!" "Fireman in the hole!" et. al.

There was one other 'breaking out of the elevator' incident on 9/11, using a window washing squeegee to gain access to a bathroom through two layers of drywall... this doesn't figure into my 'final curtain' scenario because none in the car had radios; I think it happened after the inside doors were wedged open (not top of car), and it appeared later in print as a story.

At the time, no one expected the towers to collapse; or the core to collapse so completely. Or did they?

Quote:
"Then Steve Mosiello, Chief Ganci's executive assistant, came over to the command post and he said 'We're getting reports from OEM that the buildings are not structurally sound', and of course that got our attention really quick, and Pete said, 'Well, who are we getting these reports from?' And then Steve brought an EMT person over to the command post who was I think sent as a runner to tell us this and Chief Ganci questioned him, 'Where are we getting these reports?' And his answer was something, you know, we're not sure, OEM is just reporting this." [Chief Albert Turi; NYT interview#9110142, 10/23/2001]


And he notes specifically afterwards that "within ten seconds of this conversation" collapse began. Granting as little as 40 seconds for the events described in quotes, this exchange might have occurred soon after Ladder 15 OV announced his intent to break out of the elevator shaft.

Allowing a couple more minutes for a runner to 'run', the runner is dispatched in a time window soon after Battilion 7 Chief radioed his position on 78 and described the (significantly?) low incidence of fire.

So just who -- at OEM -- if that was indeed the source, came to the conclusion that the buildings were unstable? And when?

Speculation: What if the runner's message was a result of hearing someone was approaching the impact level... was intended to trigger a 'mayday' condition that would have been reached Battilion 7 Chief; an urgent mayday on channel issued by a fellow firefighter likely to turn him back down the stairs, away from his exploration and fire-quenching effort... starting a complete evacuation of fire personnel from Tower Two?

But then... after the runner was dispatched... Ladder 15 OV announces he is commencing an attack on the sheetrock elevator shaft wall, (wouldn't take long with an axe)... time for the final curtain?


Quote:
[also Turi #9110142] "And I thought to myself that, based on other high-rise fires that had burned out of control, that we would probably have some type of localized collapse up on the upper floors, especially in the core area of the building, which I mistakenly thought was block construction. After further investigation, of course, after the fact, it wasn't block construction. The elevator cores were encased in sheetrock actually." [INTERVIEWER: For the record, would you tell us what block construction is?] "Yes. Block is usually like a four-inch cement block that's laid and that's what encloses elevator shafts. In the construction of the Trade Center, due to the high speed and the travel distance of the elevators, they used a sheetrock construction over steel so there was more give for the wind forces created by the elevators. They felt that it would probably have knocked the block over."


The "mistakenly thought was block construction" caught my attention, whether it hearkens back to a personal revision based on hearing another [informed] voice.

Behind the panels in that shaft: 'any' steel, structurally important steel? Something in the elevator shafts that might make a firefighter cry 'double-mayday'?

I can see that core layout and construction and detailed shaft layout being critical at this point to keep speculation on a rational track.

Either there was an "Eiffel Tower" inside each tower... or a concrete/rebar core... or there is the worthy "...if the cores were made of sausage, and the planes were carrying massive loads of maple syrup. This would have initiated a chain reaction of sugary delight..." [uttered by our man 'Fletch'; it has been a long time since I re-read something a dozen times, retaining its full effect. I cannot decide whether to bury or praise him. Probably both to be safe.]

I am open to consider the "concrete core" angle... it does supply an additional motive for demolition -- the battle cry of those who insist there were real "Eiffel Tower cores" with the attendant task of lots of cutting charges, could also be a notion to dispel the idea that construction was 'shoddy' or 'not to spec' in some way to avoid wrongful death suit complications -- 'crete/rebar does seem to fit the dust factor explains the momentary 'spire' -- I'd welcome any who may know old timers involved with construction to do interviews -- subject to open revisitation and second sourcing of course.

(bandwidth challenged at the moment) fair question: how many videos has the 'spire' shown up on?

This is a bit like living inside of "Carmina Burana"
Move along folks, this way to the egress.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
dilbert_g
Guest





PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2006 3:29 pm    Post subject: Freepers helped before Reply with quote

Might find interesting. Endless debates on Free Republic before they banned Libertarians like "einstein".

First I was reading Schoenman (Socialist) here, about how WTC93 was orchestrated with patsies
http://www.takingaim.info/wtc93.html

and I googled the title of an article he mentioned and found a similar post on of all places Sean Hannity's forum, and DETAILED full articles and discussion on of all places Free Republic.


on WTC1993 and OKC
including Original long articles from NYT and LAT on Emad Ali Salem
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3c830e34de.htm

on the Media and whether Chomsky is a Libertarian or Commie
Chomsky's proof [Free Republic]
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b3baabe7d4e.htm

Pentagon Report: Destruction in OKC caused by 5 Seperate Bombs
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b1aa4cb0517.htm

Listing of previous threads
http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a3b20b28f4ff1.htm

I know this will probably take too long to read the entire thread.

One other thing that was anthropoligically interesting, is how Freepers were ON TO THIS during the Clinton era. Then there seems to have been some changeover in membership and they began to "circle the wagons" around the guv'mint after Bush's election, to the point that now criticism of the right wing guv'mint and Republicans is considered SHOCKING, by newer members.
Back to top
StillDiggin



Joined: 21 Sep 2006
Posts: 88
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

When we refer to the towers as falling in the wrong order, this is based on the span of time between "impact" and "collapse."

In the spirit of this forum's topic, I would like to ask a sub-question.

If we were to base the statement with respect to the "plan," would it still hold true?

In other words, did the perpetrators plan for the south tower to "collapse" first, or did something go wrong? And if so, what was it that went wrong?

Conversely, if this order was part of the plan, why would the south tower need to fall first?

_________________
Prediction: 9/11 Without Tinfoil - Part 327: WE'RE ALMOST THERE
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Next Level Forum Index -> 9/11 HardCorps Specifics Investigation All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 3 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

Theme xand created by spleen.