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Fintan
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 8165

PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2006 7:19 pm    Post subject: Latest on Global Warming Bunk Reply with quote

Here's the key quote from the latest global warming hype:
Quote:
Antarctica's coastal glaciers shed enough meltwater every year to raise
sea levels by 0.02 of an inch
, even as new snow falling in the interior locks
up the same amount in the icecap. The result was that sea level remained
more or less the same from year to year.

"A little bit of change in one of these things could throw it all out of balance
and, evidently, that is what is going on," said University of Colorado geophysicist
John Wahr, who helped analyze the new satellite measurements.

So an increase in melting could mean sea levels go up by 0.03 of an inch
every year --instead of 0.02 --Arrrrgh!! We're Doommmed. Doomed I tell ya.

And, by the way, if the temperatures around coasts of Antartica have gone
up about 4 degrees, then it must be warmer in more tropical seas too.
Which would mean more evaporation of water --and thus more
snow falling on Antartica. Compensating for the increased melting. Duh!!

Quote:
Antarctica Cannot Replace Ice Loss

Study finds continent is shrinking faster than it can grow. Experts say changes to the global water cycle could hasten the pace of sea-level rise.

By Robert Lee Hotz, LA Times Staff Writer - March 3, 2006

The ice sheets of Antarctica — the world's largest reservoir of fresh water — are shrinking faster than new snow can fall, scientists reported Thursday in the first comprehensive satellite survey of the entire continent.

Researchers at the University of Colorado determined that between 2002 and 2005 Antarctica lost ice at a rate of 36 cubic miles a year, rather than growing from heavier snowfalls as had been predicted. That amount of ice is equivalent to about 30 times the fresh water used by Los Angeles every year.

"It is the first time we can say that if you look at the entire ice sheet, it is losing mass," said geophysicist Isabella Velicogna, whose findings were published online Thursday by the journal Science.

This month, an independent research team at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory in La Caņada Flintridge reported that the Arctic glaciers of Greenland were melting twice as fast as five years ago, adding an extra 38 cubic miles of fresh water to the Atlantic Ocean every year.

Taken together, the findings suggest that a century of steady increases in global temperatures is altering the seasonal balance of the world's water cycle, in which new snow and ice neatly offset thaw and rainfall runoff every year to maintain the current level of the seas.

If so, experts say, increasing global temperatures — the 10 warmest years on record all occurred after 1990 — may be hastening the demise of the polar icecaps and estimates of the pace of sea-level rise could be too low.

By previous calculations, Antarctica's coastal glaciers shed enough meltwater every year to raise sea levels by 0.02 of an inch, even as new snow falling in the interior locked up the same amount in the icecap. The result was that sea level remained more or less the same from year to year.

"A little bit of change in one of these things could throw it all out of balance and, evidently, that is what is going on," said University of Colorado geophysicist John Wahr, who helped analyze the new satellite measurements.

Portions of the Antarctic coast are 4.5 degrees Fahrenheit warmer than 60 years ago, research has shown.

Those same areas have lost an estimated 5,500 square miles of ice in the last 30 years, calving icebergs the size of Belgium and Rhode Island. In 2002, an entire ice shelf collapsed into the sea.

But the newest work signals a broader loss across the entire continent — an amount equal to more than 13% of the annual sea level rise measured in recent years, the researchers said. The shrinkage is concentrated in the West Antarctic Ice Sheet, which has enough fresh water to raise sea levels more than 20 feet.

The researchers based their findings on unique gravity measurements collected by a pair of orbiting satellites, the Gravity Recovery and Climate Experiment, launched in 2002.

Eric Rignot at JPL called the gravity measurement technique "a breakthrough" because the satellites allow researchers for the first time to measure changes across immense swaths of Earth's surface.

In a separate measure of the effects of changing temperatures on a continental scale, researchers in South Africa reported Thursday in Science that even minor changes in rainfall caused by climate change could drastically affect lakes, rivers and streams across one quarter of Africa by the end of the century.

Climate-driven changes in water supplies "potentially have devastating implications," said researchers Maarten de Wit and Jacek Stankiewicz of the University of Cape Town.

They used computer databases of drainage basins and global climate models to calculate the potential impact of changing rainfall patterns on drainage across Africa.
http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-sci-warming3mar03,1,4008400.story?coll=la-headlines-world


Last edited by Fintan on Wed Jan 10, 2007 11:38 pm; edited 1 time in total
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pauper



Joined: 25 Jan 2006
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fintan you're killing me here! Can you please lay out your ideas on Global Warming.
Where do you stand on this issue? I think you're points are lost, on me anyway, when you put out these posts. Do you believe in the Global Warming phenomenon at all, or are you saying it's being used as a scare tactic?
Clarification will be appreciated.
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Jerry Fletcher



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 837
Location: Studio BS

PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pauper wrote:
Do you believe in the Global Warming phenomenon at all, or are you saying it's being used as a scare tactic?


Hi pauper,
Here's an article Fintan published last year regarding climate change. I think it sheds some light on the research he's been reading.

The Battle Against Global Cooling

Here's another really interesting article you ought to check out - pretty much says the same thing; short term global warming isn't nearly as catastrophic as long term global cooling. It's got a neat 15,000 year chronology of climate change too.

Seems like we're in a temporary upswing in temperature, and that is being used as a major Scare-Op to further political agenda.

Quote:


SPEAKING FREELY
The Global Warming Scam
By Derek Kelly, PhD

Speaking Freely is an Asia Times Online feature that allows guest writers to have their say. Please click here if you are interested in contributing.

Scam, noun: a swindle, a fraudulent arrangement.

A chronology of climate change
During most of the last billion years the Earth did not have permanent ice sheets. Nevertheless, at times large areas of the globe were covered with vast sheets of ice. Such times are known as glaciations. In the past 2 million to 3 million years, the temperature of the Earth has changed (warmed or cooled) at least 17 times, some say 33, with glaciations that last about 100,000 years interrupted by warm periods that last about 10,000 years.

The last glaciation began 70,000 years ago and ended about 10,000 years ago. The Earth was a lot colder than it is now; snow and ice had accumulated on a lot of the land, glaciers existed on large areas and the sea levels were lower.

(snip...)


The Earth has also been immensely colder, the CO2 much less plentiful, and the sea levels much lower than today. Fifteen thousand years ago, the sea level was at least 90 meters lower than it is today. The land looked bare because it was too cold for beech and oak trees to grow. There were a few fir trees here and there. No grass grew, however, just shrubs, bushes and moss grass. In the northern parts of North America, Europe and Asia there was still tundra. The animals were different from today too. Back then there were woolly mammoth, woolly rhinos, cave bears (the former three now extinct), bison, wolves, horses, and herds of reindeer like modern-day reindeer.

The major "sin" for the global warmists is CO2. The Kyoto treaty is meant to reduce the amount of this gas so as, they say, to reduce the degree of warming and eventually return us to some stable climate system. If we look at the historical situation, however, this is cause for alarm. For one thing, there has never been a stable climate system. For another, the level of CO2 in our atmosphere is near its historic low. In the long run, the greatest danger is too little rather than too much CO2. There has been a long-term reduction of CO2 throughout the 4.5-billion-year history of the Earth. If this tendency continues, eventually our planet may become as lifeless as Mars.

Glaciation has prevailed for 90% of the last several million years. Extreme cold. Biting cold. Cold too intense for bikinis and swimming trunks. No matter what scary scenarios global-warming enthusiasts dream up, they pale in comparison with the conditions another ice age would deliver. Look to our past climate. Fifteen thousand years ago, an ice sheet a kilometer and a half thick covered all of North America north of a line stretching from somewhere around Seattle to Cleveland and New York City.

Instead of reducing CO2, we should, perhaps, be increasing it. We should pay the smokestack industries hard dollars for every kilogram of soot they pump into the atmosphere. Instead of urging Chinese to stop using coal and turn instead to nuclear-generated electricity, we should beg them to continue using coal. Rather than bringing us to the edge of global-warming catastrophe, anthropogenic climate change may have spared us descent into what would be the most serious and far-reaching challenge facing humankind in the 21st century - dealing with a rapidly deteriorating climate that wants to plunge us into an ice age. Let's hope Antarctica and Greenland melt. Let's hope the sea levels rise. All life glorifies warmth. Only death prefers the icy fingers of endless winter.

From: Asia Times Online :: Asian News, Business and Economy.
http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Front_Page/GB25Aa02.html
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pauper



Joined: 25 Jan 2006
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Beautiful. So it's alarmist scientists and a great manipulation of facts.

Thanks.
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Jerry Fletcher



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 837
Location: Studio BS

PostPosted: Wed Mar 29, 2006 12:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pauper wrote:
So it's alarmist scientists and a great manipulation of facts.


Otherwise known as "The News". Wink
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Damian Flynn



Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 219
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2006 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's good to have some comic relief sometimes. This video put a smile on my face.

Global Warming Protest


Last edited by Damian Flynn on Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:43 am; edited 1 time in total
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BLONDIE



Joined: 07 Jun 2006
Posts: 7

PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2006 3:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We were told our pollution was destroying the ozone level and urged us to recycle. Not blaming big business too much; it was our fault!
How are they going to blame consumers like us , for global warming?
I'm sure thats coming soon!!!
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Ozregeneration



Joined: 23 Jan 2006
Posts: 484
Location: Big Island Down Under

PostPosted: Wed Jun 07, 2006 5:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Damian Flynn wrote:
It's good to have some comic relief sometimes. This video put a smile on my face.

http://www.current.tv/studio/media/763


Good one to start the day with. Laughing

P.S. How are your plants surviving?
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Damian Flynn



Joined: 29 Jan 2006
Posts: 219
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello Ozregeneration,

Last edited by Damian Flynn on Thu Dec 20, 2007 6:37 am; edited 1 time in total
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Janama



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 410
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

excuse me - that article from the Asian Times is complete and utter bullshit.
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Jerry Fletcher



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 837
Location: Studio BS

PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Janama wrote:
excuse me - that article from the Asian Times is complete and utter bullshit.


But what do you really think about it? Wink hehe.

Fill me in! If I bought a snow job from Dr. Kelley, I'd like to know - I posted it as logical sounding, not gospel.

If I'm spreading bull, please stop me!
thx.
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Janama



Joined: 21 Jan 2006
Posts: 410
Location: Australia

PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah - that was a bit flippant - sorry I didn't mean to be rude. Wink

Two points to start with Jerry. The changes in climate he refers to took thousands of years to evolve - yes New York used to be covered in Ice - they tell me you can see the see the deep grooves in the rock as it retreated in Central Park. Whereas the current changes are happening over 100s of years like from 1900 - 2000.

Quote:
For another, the level of CO2 in our atmosphere is near its historic low.


The current CO2 levels are higher than ever recorded before, NOT lower, and it is steadily increasing.


May I suggest you listen to this interview with Stephen H. Schneider
Professor in the Department of Biological Sciences; co-director at the Centre for Environmental Sciences and Policy of the Freeman Spogli Institute for International Studies at Stanford University.

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/latenightlive/stories/2006/1638979.htm

Whilst you are there bookmark the Late Night Live site

http://www.abc.net.au/rn/latenightlive/

- Philip does some excellent interviews like this one with Brigadier General (Retired) Janis Karpinski. Former Commander of Abu Ghraib prison in Iraq.


http://www.abc.net.au/rn/latenightlive/stories/2006/1642145.htm
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