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Jordan Peterson

 
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just0



Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:24 am    Post subject: Jordan Peterson Reply with quote

He's been going viral for a few years now, this seems like a good conversation so far..... thoughts ?


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Peter



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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

On the curve of conscious awareness, the inflection point is the cusp between self-knowledge and total knowledge. Rather than AI or google or crowd-fundinģ or cloud sourcing, understanding comes from meaning and that is a revelation from, of and to self. We are, after all, universes unto ourselves.
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Fintan
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PostPosted: Sat Feb 23, 2019 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I trimmed the hate from a Guardian article Wink
to leave the basic picture of JP in the media:

Quote:
So, what does Peterson actually believe? He bills himself as “a classic British liberal” whose focus is the psychology of belief. Much of what he says is familiar: marginalised groups are infantilised by a culture of victimhood and offence-taking; political correctness threatens freedom of thought and speech; ideological orthodoxy undermines individual responsibility. You can read this stuff any day of the week and perhaps agree with some of it.

His bete noire is what he calls “postmodern neo-Marxism” or “cultural Marxism”. In a nutshell: having failed to win the economic argument, Marxists decided to infiltrate the education system and undermine western values with “vicious, untenable and anti-human ideas”, such as identity politics, that will pave the road to totalitarianism.

He claims that concepts fundamental to social-justice movements, such as the existence of patriarchy and other forms of structural oppression, are treacherous illusions, and that he can prove this with science.

Hence: “The idea that women were oppressed throughout history is an appalling theory.” Islamophobia is “a word created by fascists and used by cowards to manipulate morons”. White privilege is “a Marxist lie”. Believing that gender identity is subjective is “as bad as claiming that the world is flat”.


https://www.theguardian.com/science/2018/feb/07/how-dangerous-is-jordan-b-peterson-the-rightwing-professor-who-hit-a-hornets-nest


Lotta that is just Peterson doing self-promo with sensationalist views.

His analysis of reciprocity in the developing infant is cute.
The roots of human morality in a spoon giving/taking game. Wink
And cool that max reciprocity among masses is evolutionary.

But tidying your room as a basis for evolution?!? lol
At this point Peterson is like your mom.. on steroids.

And the untidy room is not a moral and political defect.

It's just that younger people have more important things
to be doing than cleaning some fucking room! Wink

Mr. Peterson likes everything in its proper place.

His arguments against "collectivism" and Marxism are on
first sight supportive of keeping establishments in place.

He maintains that those outside the power structure lack
"competence" and thus revolutionary zeal is merely
jealousy gone mad.

Is there beef I'm missing?

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Fintan
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PostPosted: Sun Feb 24, 2019 8:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Peterson's defense of the individual against the collective is solid,
but this is old ground and rather simplistically covered.

There's a deeper examination of this issue.

The individual -v- society battle is nailed in the obscure
Pirsig Zen& the Art sequel: "Lila An Inquiry into Morals":















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just0



Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Peter, the water is warm, the waves are sweet, our awareness
is revealed by revealing our awareness of our inflecting upon our own
inflection point............................ Sorry dude, I'm no great poet Sad Laughing


Fintan, gotta say I think you may have to go a bit deeper on this one.
I think this guy has some legit Jungian insights to back this up.
Not that I need to namedrop... but really Smile

I think the point of his 'cleaning your room', is pretty important in
a personal 'morality' perspective.

Whoever is claiming to have a moral superiority should have their
own basics sorted out! And with that, like any achievement, comes
a confidence, which is a plus to development.

And I think it helps with people overwhelmed by huge tasks, to take
it step by step is beneficial, cleaning your room, overcoming small
tasks is a good way to start the process of overcoming the impossible.
I think that's the point. Not a militant or motherly attitude, it's self
regulated self improving. Not comparing to others but comparing to
your former self.

Rebelling against something destructive is of course beneficial, but the
focus is the key. I think he's helping a lot of young people with that,
which is good.



Quote:
There's a deeper examination of this issue.

The individual -v- society battle is nailed in the obscure
Pirsig Zen& the Art sequel: "Lila An Inquiry into Morals":
................


That's just a brilliant piece, those are some gems I've never read before....
'Lila An Inquiry into Morals', here we go!!

But on that piece, I feel like it's echoing more of Arthur M. Young's work,
I could imagine this exact excerpt from his works.

From inorganic matter to higher life forms, it's a hierarchy of morals.
And it seems to be Wink

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Last edited by just0 on Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:24 pm; edited 1 time in total
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just0



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Whoever is claiming to have a moral superiority should have their
own basics sorted out

Sorry, that's not always true, but still there's a confidence
that comes with knowing you've got your shit sorted out.
Even if it's just a bit.

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Peter



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 01, 2019 4:08 pm    Post subject: One for all and all for one. Reply with quote

Exchanging with you two is always such a pleasure. Peterson also wears his vibe well. His is almost a desperate determination. He is intent on passing his understanding along and provides a clear and concise presentation.

Any and all forms of specification cannot be drawn from generalizations but only from basics and fundamental principles. Extending one's knowledge through awareness leads to a description of meaning that is universal in its presence and utility. We all have this capacity, some more than others. Thanks guys, you make my day, every day. Smile

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just0



Joined: 22 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2019 2:07 pm    Post subject: Re: One for all and all for one. Reply with quote

Peter wrote:
Exchanging with you two is always such a pleasure. Peterson also wears his vibe well. His is almost a desperate determination. He is intent on passing his understanding along and provides a clear and concise presentation.

Any and all forms of specification cannot be drawn from generalizations but only from basics and fundamental principles. Extending one's knowledge through awareness leads to a description of meaning that is universal in its presence and utility. We all have this capacity, some more than others. Thanks guys, you make my day, every day. Smile


There he goes again with the poetic phrases, It's very nice,
but I just can't keep up Smile
Like a pizza of understanding, with a stuffed crust of meaning.....
consciousness dip on the side... how my doin' ? Laughing

Peterson has been getting around quite a lot lately, it's a lot of self
promotion, but from what I can tell he's always been trying to spread
his ideas as far and wide as possible. Seems to be a fear of what we as
a species can inflict upon each other, he's put many years into trying to
understand why events like the holocaust, the gulags etc.
could be. He seems to think that the future of society could be easily
reverted to that kind of chaos.

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Peter



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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2019 4:50 am    Post subject: Don't let the beat drop... Reply with quote

The real beauty of our reality is when it is stated in such a way that we already knew it, we just didn't know that we knew it. Peterson really seems to be taking advantage of his 15 minutes but his recapitulations of his research (not necessarily exhaustive) and the conclusions and meaning that he draws from them are always on point and to the point. Not so much a sage or philosopher as a would-be Cassandra. As always, take what you need and leave the rest as there is a lot to go around these days... Wink
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just0



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PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:48 am    Post subject: Re: Don't let the beat drop... Reply with quote

Peter wrote:
The real beauty of our reality is when it is stated in such a way that we already knew it, we just didn't know that we knew it. Peterson really seems to be taking advantage of his 15 minutes but his recapitulations of his research (not necessarily exhaustive) and the conclusions and meaning that he draws from them are always on point and to the point. Not so much a sage or philosopher as a would-be Cassandra. As always, take what you need and leave the rest as there is a lot to go around these days... Wink


Sage-ley and time-ly words as always Peter, and seasoned to perfection Exclamation Smile
Our own unconscious and conscious bias decides what we can 'take or leave',
which is based on unchallenged or flimsy ideas we're reluctant to change.
Whichever way you see as the truth is the way forward Wink

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Peter



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PostPosted: Mon Mar 18, 2019 4:31 am    Post subject: The spot that's not... Reply with quote

just0 wrote:
Peter wrote:
The real beauty of our reality is when it is stated in such a way that we already knew it, we just didn't know that we knew it. Peterson really seems to be taking advantage of his 15 minutes but his recapitulations of his research (not necessarily exhaustive) and the conclusions and meaning that he draws from them are always on point and to the point. Not so much a sage or philosopher as a would-be Cassandra. As always, take what you need and leave the rest as there is a lot to go around these days... Wink


Sage-ley and time-ly words as always Peter, and seasoned to perfection Exclamation Smile
Our own unconscious and conscious bias decides what we can 'take or leave',
which is based on unchallenged or flimsy ideas we're reluctant to change.
Whichever way you see as the truth is the way forward Wink


Spot on, Justin. It is the awareness of those biases that reveals that way forward. As creatures of habit, we leave plenty of reminders lying around.... unburdening ourselves of those charges is the only road to enlightenment Wink

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