Yesterday saw two competing theories on the downing of MH17 -
the official preliminary report from the Netherlands-based inquiry
and an alternative explanation from Almaz Antey, who are the
manufacturer of the Buk missiles used in the region by
Russian and Ukrainian forces.
The meat of the matter comes down to close examination of the
signature effects of an exploding missile on the air frame of a jet.
Buk missile manufacturer, Almaz Antey said it had used a
9N314M Buk war-head to blow up the cockpit of a similar aircraft
in a controlled explosion experiment on October 7.
The company says the blast produced very distinctive butterfly-shaped
holes that it said were produced by heavy metal fragments in the warhead
and which were not been seen on MH17’s air frame wreckage.
The company said MH17 was brought down by a 9M38 missile, an older
model of Buk that Russia withdrew from service in 2011, but of which
Ukraine is still believed to holds stocks.
The company also said their experiment failed to replicate damage
seen on the cowling of MH17’s left engine. My understanding of their
poorly translated presentation is that the lack of engine damage means
the missile --as it was exploding-- was catching up MH17 from one side
(launched near Zarochenske, south-west of the crash site), rather than
closing in on the jet from separatist-controlled Znizhnein front.
See Close-Up Map below:
Above: you can see an explosive disc of metal fragments around
the (red) warhead area of the missile as it detonates.
From the Amlaz-Antey presentation, the speed and direction of a missile
affect the spray pattern of fragments resulting from it's detonation:
So it requires a precise orientation and direction of the missile to inflict
the damage seen to the cockpit area AND the left engine cowling. That's
the heart of the analysis of missile direction and thus the perpatrators.
Here's a video of the Buk manufacturer's replication of the explosion:
Here's a translation voiceover of their press presentation yesterday.
About one hour in we get to some of the key points. But you can scan
thru the whole video of the conference for some informative graphics.
The science and engineering skills in recreating the blast and in the
analysis of missile damage and the incoming missile vector analysis
are first class and are international air accident inquiry standard.
This Almaz Antey analysis cannot be dismissed, and I will examine
it further and watch with interest for reflective reaction from the many
skeptical critics who have been following the case.
As a side note, earlier theories that MH370 was downed by an air to air
missile fired by a Ukranian fighter jet can now be ruled out by the weight
of evidence in both of yesterday's competing scientific presentations.
Finally, it seems I am still the only commentator
to maintain that both the recent Malaylsian air
tragedies were the work of NWO Black Ops:
In a series of interviews in The Netherlands and Australia,
Anderson and other Australian Federal Police colleagues who
were on the MH17 front line have given rare glimpses into a
complex international operation, in which the emotional
challenge was underscored by Anderson's AFP colleague
Dr Sarah Benson, who told me: "We were there to see
justice done … and we needed to find our own."
Fifteen months after the tragic loss of MH17 over war-torn Ukraine
the Dutch Safety Board has presented the results of its investigation.
Will we ever learn the “who” and “why” parts of this tragedy?
from Zerohedge :
Have you ever heard of an air traffic crash investigation where the Black
Box was kept secret? Have you ever heard of an air crash investigation
that didn’t even ask for the air traffic control tapes?
When has an air crash investigation NOT asked for testimony of the Air
Traffic Controller who was in contact and handled the planes flight details?
The bitch woman who was on MH-17 has been on vaction for over a year
and a half, not seen or heard from. She never went back to the tower.
CNN and NPR pretend with a straight face that this is even an investigation!
kind of reminds me of the 9-11 investigation
(no black box data released whatsoever).
this also looked fishy to me:
Malaysia not only disallows inquests. It has forbidden family members of
the 43 Malaysian victims from opening the coffins. None of the kin of those
killed was permitted to view the victims in their coffins, Wan Lailatul
Masturah said. “We were not allowed by the government, nobody must
see. All the corpses who came back were not allowed to be opened.”
Remember the Germanwings crash? It took less than 72 hours to release
the cockpit recordings. Yet the Fucking Dutch can’t produce them after 15
_________________ Minds are like parachutes.
They only function when open.
ISMAILIA, EGYPT/CAIRO | BY YUSRI MOHAMMED AND AHMED MOHAMED HASSAN
A Russian airliner carrying 224 passengers and crew crashed in Egypt's
Sinai peninsula on Saturday after losing radar contact and plummeting
from its cruising altitude, killing all aboard.
The Airbus A321, operated by Russian airline Kogalymavia under the
brand name Metrojet, was flying from the Sinai Red Sea resort of Sharm
el-Sheikh to St Petersburg in Russia when it went down in a desolate
mountainous area of central Sinai soon after daybreak, the aviation
A north Sinai security source said initial examination showed the crash was
due to a technical fault, but gave no detail. The plane, he said, had landed
in a "vertical fashion", explaining the scale of devastation and burning.
Based on the "vertical" impact described above, this looks like a stall.
Stalls like this are often found to have resulted from
pilot error due to instrument error.
Here's the timeline in reverse order - latest first.
I don't buy the Islamic State claim of responsibility.
Islamic State group in Egypt claims it downed Russian airliner
Russian state transport regulator had found violations during last flight safety inspection of plane which crashed in Egypt. But after the inspection, which took place in March 2014, the airline remedied the breaches within the deadlines it had been set, Interfax reported.
Initial examination shows Russian plane crashed in Egypt's Sinai due to technical fault, say north Sinai security sources
Russian officials searching Moscow offices of Kogalymavia, have seized documents line Kogalymavia respected flight safety rules
Egyptian authorities report that there are no survivors in the Russian plane crash
Pilot had reported technical problems in flying the plane. The Russian RIA news agency, citing sources at Sharm el-Sheikh, said: "The pilot contacted the dispatcher and reported technical problems, asking for a change of the route and a landing at Cairo airport, after which communication was broken."
Russian Airline Kogalymavia says sees no grounds to blame human error for crash in Egypt
Russian President Vladimir Putin orders emergency teams to Egypt plane crash site
A Russian passenger plane that crashed in Egypt's Sinai peninsula on Saturday was carrying 214 Russian passengers and three Ukrainians, the Egyptian cabinet said in a statement. Out of the total 217 passengers, 138 were women, 62 men and 17 were children, the cabinet statement added.
Egyptian rescue team finds crashed Russian plane's black box
Russia Putin declares National Day of Mourning on November 1 after plane crash in Egypt
Russia's top Investigative Committee has launched a case against airline Kogalymavia under an article regulating "violation of rules of flights and preparations for them" after a Kogalymavia airliner crashed in Egypt on Saturday, Russian news agencies said, citing the committee's spokesman
Egyptian Civil Aviation Minister Mohamed Hossam Kemal said it was "too soon to determine the cause" of a Russian passenger plane crash in the country's Sinai peninsula, a cabinet statement quoted him as saying on Saturday.
Israeli military said on Saturday it had offered its help to Egypt and Russia after a Russian airliner carrying 224 passengers and crew crashed in the Sinai peninsula.
Russian President Vladimir Putin expresses condolences to victims' families
Voices of trapped passengers could be heard in section of Russian plane crashed in Egypt's Sinai, officer on scene.
Egyptian Prosecutoe General orders team of prosecutors to site of Russian plane crash, orders investigation- Prosecutors source
The plane was at an altitude of 31,000 feet when it vanished from radar screens, the ministry said in a statement.
Egyptian search and rescue teams have found the site of the crashed Russian passenger plane in the Hassana area, south of Arish, Sinai, the civilian aviation ministry said on Saturday.
Most passengers likely to have died, says security officer at scene.
Pilot had reported technical problems in flying the plane. The Russian RIA
news agency, citing sources at Sharm el-Sheikh, said: "The pilot contacted
the dispatcher and reported technical problems, asking for a change of the
route and a landing at Cairo airport, after which communication was broken."
Its now reported that the Egyption Aviation Minister has said that the crew
did not report any technical issues despite earlier reports and nor did they
request help or declare an emergency.
So everything about that earlier report
by RIA news agency was wrong.
Gosh guys. You're a great help.
Keep up the ace reporting. Not.
Now the talk is of a massive mechanical failure.
I'll try get sight of some fire thru all this smoke. _________________ Minds are like parachutes.
They only function when open.
Handle with caution because the dataset may be subject to misinterpretation,
but this is the computed elevation of MetroJet A321 in the final 1 Minute.
Those sharp descents and recoveries are over a 30 seconds time frame.
Hard to believe that a large jet could respond like that, so the data needs
confirming - but points to stalls and pitch control failure or similar cause. _________________ Minds are like parachutes.
They only function when open.
In a previous post, I said that the fact that the BRICS have sat back and done nothing is very telling. They should have come in much sooner but Russia's presence in there is now being felt and ran contrary to what I said, evidently I was wrong on this.
You are also right on what you saw as the ending of most hostilities in the Ukraine, but I ask myself at what cost? While the russian rebels have protected the borders of Russia, is it not the case that the bread basket of Ukraine has now been captured and duly being poisoned?. Is it not the case that political power has now been captured by the EU fucks and with it, it is now becoming just another client state?.
“Russia is beginning with what we define as a” quiet support ” supplying advanced technology and preparing a spearhead force before reaching a further level we call the” stormy Support “. We expect a large presence of troops that will be supported by Russian Air Force. There are around 2500 Russian fighters, military expert and consultant in Syria. The number is expected to go much higher in the near future “, confirm the source that is in contact with the Russian units on the Syrian ground.
That paragraph, is telling and leads us deeper into world war 3 because these fanatical, oppressive regimes like Turkey, the US, the EU! Saudi Arabia, Qatar etc are not going to sit by and allow the Russians to destroy their psychopathic jihadists.
So again, whilst I admit that you have been right about some of these events Fintan, I would contend that far from winning world war 3, we are only just about starting world war 3. World war 3 is going to be western chaos as much as it is about the middle east and I can only hope that you are right.
As for the plane coming down, I am cautious to say anything, but I don't think it's beyond the realms of possibility that there are missile launchers which could have taken down the plane. I am certainly cautious about deeming this to be a mechanical issue given the timing, given the location.
For 48 hours the media propagandists had a huge ISIL party. Did ISIL- or didn't ISIL? Why would they? Why couldn't they?!
Bulls**t : the black box soundtrack hears no missile strike.
So back to the real world, where meanwhile:
Russian jet operator MetroJet has been spinning like crazy to claim that
neither pilot error nor tech failure could have caused the wild gyrations
in altitude seen in the graphic I posted above.
True, but sudden a structural failure involving decompression could
if it blew the tail section off the back of the plane - and that's a key
explanation already gaining currency.
MetroJet are worried that any failure to properly test the tail repair
as part of the regular certification process would get them blamed.
They should chill.
The crew could well have scraped the tail again on it's final takeoff.
Tough break maybe, but time and thorough crash analysis will tell. _________________ Minds are like parachutes.
They only function when open.
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