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Tony Ryals



Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 8:27 pm    Post subject: Meat and the Second Law of Bio-Thermodynamics Reply with quote

Uh,so we should continue over eating meat that requires AT LEAST 10 times more water than a vegetarian diet than can provide all our amino acid needs simply by obeying the rule of combining both grains and beans together at the same meal ? And because the animals are packed tightly in smelly and gross feedlots what grains are brought to them and chickens require about 4 times or pounds of grains to make a pound of chicken and cows require ten times the amount of grains to makes a pound of meat and the water needs are simply ridiculous based upon world human population that is growing out of hand as it is your 'logic' verges upon the insane.It is true that Indian vegans didn't get any Vitamin B 12 or cobalamin from their strict veggie diet they get it without knowing they are eating dead insects in the grains that are providing that b 12 or cobalamin.And it is true that grain diet without animal liver or fat and or fish oil have no source of Vitamin D but that is white people including Chinese,Japanese and Koreans have lighter skin than Southerners - in order to make it by sun reacting with oils on the skin so that can be solved by a Vitamin D supplement if necessary.
I think you should read Francis Moore Lappe's Diet For A Small Planet and think about what you are saying.
Oh and I didn't even mention the most important point.We no longer get our minerals from the soil,it's depleted so we must mine phosphate in Florida or Idaho,an enviro disaster and potassium in Saskatchewan Canada.We may become dependent on a new OPEC or Phosphate Exporting Country like Morocco based on your justification of a mainly meat diet and have to murder their leaders under the lie of bringing them 'democracy'.
To eat mainly chicken means mining phosphate and potassium four times faster per person or cow meat TEN times more mining.I think I'd rather take my chances with learning to eat and enjoy grains and beans that in fact or more varied than chicken and cows.
Unfortunately without birth control we're all fucked.
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EddieT



Joined: 28 Jun 2006
Posts: 477

PostPosted: Thu Jul 15, 2010 11:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Meat and the Second Law of Bio-Thermodynamics Reply with quote

Tony Ryals wrote:
Uh,so we should continue over eating meat that requires AT LEAST 10 times more water than a vegetarian diet than can provide all our amino acid needs simply by obeying the rule of combining both grains and beans together at the same meal ? And because the animals are packed tightly in smelly and gross feedlots what grains are brought to them and chickens require about 4 times or pounds of grains to make a pound of chicken and cows require ten times the amount of grains to makes a pound of meat and the water needs are simply ridiculous based upon world human population that is growing out of hand as it is your 'logic' verges upon the insane.It is true that Indian vegans didn't get any Vitamin B 12 or cobalamin from their strict veggie diet they get it without knowing they are eating dead insects in the grains that are providing that b 12 or cobalamin.And it is true that grain diet without animal liver or fat and or fish oil have no source of Vitamin D but that is white people including Chinese,Japanese and Koreans have lighter skin than Southerners - in order to make it by sun reacting with oils on the skin so that can be solved by a Vitamin D supplement if necessary.
I think you should read Francis Moore Lappe's Diet For A Small Planet and think about what you are saying.
Oh and I didn't even mention the most important point.We no longer get our minerals from the soil,it's depleted so we must mine phosphate in Florida or Idaho,an enviro disaster and potassium in Saskatchewan Canada.We may become dependent on a new OPEC or Phosphate Exporting Country like Morocco based on your justification of a mainly meat diet and have to murder their leaders under the lie of bringing them 'democracy'.
To eat mainly chicken means mining phosphate and potassium four times faster per person or cow meat TEN times more mining.I think I'd rather take my chances with learning to eat and enjoy grains and beans that in fact or more varied than chicken and cows.
Unfortunately without birth control we're all fucked.


Wo. Slow down man. We all know that factory farming and monocrop agriculture are bad deals for everyone involved. No one is promoting that kind of thing here.

I purchase raw milk from a local farm and local, grass-fed meat. No environmental disasters on my plate. Just healthy food.

Check out the Weston A Price Foundation or eatwild.com. Find a local farmer and for God sakes don't go vegan...that's a total scam.

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bri



Joined: 16 Jun 2006
Posts: 3174
Location: Capacious Creek

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 12:19 am    Post subject: Re: Meat and the Second Law of Bio-Thermodynamics Reply with quote

EddieT wrote:
for God sakes don't go vegan...that's a total scam.


But it's sooooo hip and so cool. Are you telling me that too much soy is a bad thing? Evil or Very Mad
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Tony Ryals



Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 10:27 am    Post subject: The fate of phosphates is also your fate Reply with quote

That's fine.I'm happy for you but the food sources you recommend are biophysically impossible for the masses,for us peasants.I have no idea how long the soil providing your meat can hold up ater the trees have been cut and converted to pasture but I can tell you that it would be impossible that everyone from New York City to Rio de Janeiro to Peking
to London afford the luxury you recommend.That's all I'm saying.Get it ?
The more productive an agroecosystem is the faster it depletes nutrients from the soil.
I didn't come here to nitpick about about hormone mimics in soy beans,but I will say it's interesting that Asian women eating soy beans in Asia have no incidence of breast cancer than American women.And most who eat meat - even so-called 'Kosher' that 'white semites' of European
say is best can't be sure what they heil they are really eating. Agriprocessors of Iowa with their Guatemalan wage slaves and illegal rabbis from Est Europe praying or preying night and day proved that.They even had a mad cow or two in their 'kosher' meat plant if you can believe that or not.
And while meat is generally only cow or chicken unless you've decided to
hunt nurria in what's left of the bayous of Louisiana or perhaps dear or moose which again wouldn't feed the masses or us peasants,beans are not limited to 'soy',as you must know.I'vew only said it was a fact that you can get complete protein y combining grains with beans that as good in fact the same amino acids found in meat.
What I've said about water demand and fertilizer demand above remains a fact no matter how many time bri says 'fuck you' or how many priests or rabbis bless rotten mad cow 'kosher' meat.And I have criticized vegetarians for believing their veggies were all so 'organic' before as well,
pointing out that that any hchicken horse or cow manure used in their compost to make fertilizer is subsidized whether they realise it or not by mining phosphate in florida,etc., or from potassium in Canada that was used to feed the animals that provided the fertilizer they use in the first place.



http://www.phillyimc.org/en/node/68968

W Bush,Chabad-Lubavitch,Agriprocessors: Kosher Guns,Drugs,ICE,Ilegal Rabbis,Guatemala Wage Slaves

Jun 17, 2008 ... meat potentially tainted with Mad Cow Disease. Agriprocessors refused torecognize its employees' vote to unionize. ...



http://malta.indymedia.org/node/8796


Phosphates and the Pope's Misconceptions about conception and science history
Submitted by Anonymous on Thu, 2010-06-24 20:24
in

* International

Pope's Misconceptions about conception and science history by Tony Ryals

* Environment
* International

The fate of phosphates is also the church's fate.Rabbi's and priests,like pope's and the general population,also excrete about a pound and a half of phosphates from their bodies per year or per earth orbit.Approximately 25% of that phosphate is excreted after use by the human brain which means that on a psyco-physical level,by not recycling those phosphates we are literally throwing our dreams away.

The pope's apparent ignorance of science history and modern agricultural technology obscures from his vision the disastrous effects of his policy of unchecked population growth on future generations who will find "no food on the table" nor the resources with which to grow it. This ignorance also shows that the pope has no more expertise in the fields of agricultural science, population planning, or resoure management than the pope in Galileo's time did in the area of astronomy.

Pope's Stances Lack Scientific Basis
by Tony Ryals
The Daily Californian September 22, 1987

On Nov. 10, 1979, a meeting was held in Rome by the Pontifical Academy of Sciences in honor of the 100th year anniversary of the birth of Albert Einstein. The meeting marked the first time in the history of the church, since the formation of its own science academy, that any pope had presided over such a session.

This meeting of the Pontifical Academy of Sciences may well be more memorable for Pope John Paul II's statements regarding science, Galileo, and the church than for the honoring of the centenary of the birth of Einstein himself.

In discussing the case of Galileo and the church, Pope John Paul II addressed the academy as follows:

"Mr.President, you said very rightly that Galileo and Einstein each characterized an era. The greatness of Galileo is recognized by all, as is that of Einstein, but while today we honor the latter before the College of Cardinals in the apostolic palace, the former had to suffer much - we cannot deny it - from men and orgainzations within the church. The Vatican Council has recognized and deplored unwarranted interferences..."

Approximately one year after his Pontifical Academy of Science speech on Galileo, the pope, in criticizing what he termed "artificial" methods birth control, made a notable statement on modern agriculture, simultaneously. The pope stated:

"There are attacks on fecundity itself with means that human and Christian ethics must consider illicit... Instead of increasing the amount of bread on the table of a hungry humanity as a modern means of production can do today, there are thoughts of diminishing the number of those at the table through methods that are contrary to honesty. This is not worthy of civilization."

Now that the pope has pardoned Galileo for telling the church that the earth is in orbit around the sun, it is time to tell the pope that the other half of Aristotle's church-approved cosmology has also come unglued. The "Four Element" concept (earth, air, fire and water) was the other half of the Aristotelian Earth-centered universe adopted by St.Thomas Aquinas in the 13th century.

Although the Renaissance astronomers successfully challenged Aristotle's and the church's geocentric universe several centuries later, atoms still had not been discovered. For this reason the Four Elements remained intact and unchallenged long after the death of Galileo in 1642.

The discovery of atoms in the last couple of centuries has totally transformed our concept of elements. The former "elements", earth and air, are both composed of a variety of elements. We now know that even the ancient element "water" can be further divided into the elements of hydrogen and oxygen. And the element "fire" is now understood to be a form of radiation.

Justus Von Liebig, the 19th century father of agricultural chemistry, and other pioneering chemists did to Aristotle's Four Elements what the Renaissance astronomers did to Aristotle's concept of the Earth as the center of the universe - they overturned it!

Liebig first pointed out the for plants to utilize carbon dioxide in the air for growth, they must have adequate amounts of nitrogen, phosphorus, and potassium in their soil. Unfortunately, in popularizing the N,P,K concept of modern chemical agriculture, Liebig paved the way for overreliance upon energy-intensive fossil fuel consumption in the mining of phosphorus and potassium as well as in industrial production of nitrogen fertilizers.

We now know that for every orbit of the Earth around the sun - one year - the pope, each member of the Catholic Church, and everyone else on the planet consumes in their food and excretes from their bodies approximately two pounds of phosphorus and various quantities of nitrogen, calcium, potassium, iron, and other trace elements. All these elements generally go unrecycled, often into rivers and oceans or even municipal dumps, further enriching fertilizer industries (who will sell the farmers more for a price) at the expense of the Earth's non-renewable mineral nutrient resources.

When the remaining fossil fuels, particularly natural gas, are exhausted, only bacteria and blue-green algae utilizing phosphorus, potassium, and trace elements in "soil-culture" and "aqua-culture" will be likely candidates to fix atmospheric nitrogen for agricultural fertilization.

Both the trade of grains and the direct trade of phosphates speed the depletion of our limited reserves of phosphate rock in the United States, which comes mainly from mining operations in Florida. Deposits in Idaho are also being mined, at present, and Armand Hammer of Occidental Petroleum has eyed public land near Ojai, Calif. to strip-mine for phosphates.

We should realize the need to conserve our dwindling reserves of phosphates for future generations. The United States not long ago was a net exporter of petroleum, but now we are importers. The same situation could occur with phosphates if we refuse to learn from the past. Some researchers have suggested that we may become dependent upon yet a new OPEC (or Organization of Phosphate Exporting Countries), such as Morocco, with its relatively large rock phosphate reserves.

The U.S. General Accounting Office estimates that our reserves of phosphorus will be depleted some time in the next century. This will inevitably lead to a food and population crisis that will make our oil crisis seem minor by comparison.

The pope's apparent ignorance of science history and modern agricultural technology obscures from his vision the disastrous effects of his policy of unchecked population growth on future generations who will find "no food on the table" nor the resources with which to grow it. This ignorance also shows that the pope has no more expertise in the fields of agricultural science, population planning, or resoure management than the pope in Galileo's time did in the area of astronomy.

The nutrients that subsidize the life of the pope, and everyone on the planet, are a finite resource. Unless the pope realizes the seriousness of the linear flow of elements through himself and the rest of humanity, he shall be partly responsible for contributing to the collapse of modern agriculture.

To sum up, Pope John Paul II is as confused about the movement of atoms as the pope of Galileo's time was about the movement of the Earth and celestial bodies. Based upon the rate of depletion of chemical fertilizers, the present pope does not have 300 years to re-evaluate his view on modern agriculture and birth control. The question still remains as to why the Pontifical Academy of Sciences has not made this disastrous movement of atoms clear to the pope.
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EddieT



Joined: 28 Jun 2006
Posts: 477

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
The more productive an agroecosystem is the faster it depletes nutrients from the soil.


Not if it is managed correctly. I guess you've never heard of Joel Salatin.

Quote:
Asian women eating soy beans in Asia have no incidence of breast cancer than American women.


It's a myth that Asians eat a lot of soy:

http://www.westonaprice.org/soy-alert/266-myths-and-truths-about-soy.html

Quote:
you can get complete protein y combining grains with beans that as good in fact the same amino acids found in meat.


Doing so with wheat and soy also gives the added benefit of immune system-depleting gluten and phytoestrogen assault, neither of which will occur when one eats grass-fed beef or bison.

Quote:
I'm happy for you but the food sources you recommend are biophysically impossible for the masses,for us peasants. I have no idea how long the soil providing your meat can hold up ater the trees have been cut and converted to pasture but I can tell you that it would be impossible that everyone from New York City to Rio de Janeiro to Peking
to London afford the luxury you recommend.That's all I'm saying.Get it ?


You can scream about the sky falling all you want. At the end of the day, the best decision you can make about food is the one that is going to be the best for YOUR health. Eating a diet that is unsustainable for YOU isn't going to make the planet any more sustainable, just more miserable. Start with the small decisions you can make to improve your life and then see what happens.

_________________
"Man is the only creature who refuses to be what he is"- Albert Camus
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Tony Ryals



Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 1:01 pm    Post subject: You are full of excrement and it's leaking Reply with quote

As I told my former Congressman,(now CIA Director), Leon Panetta,my statement in the Santa Cruz Environmental Impact Report that building a bigger pipe into the ocean in California only meant a larger population would each,per person,be excreting like you me the nazi pope benedict and scumbag rabbis,be excretring about a pund and a half of phosphates from their bodies per earth orbit.So where does your poud and a half of phosphates go when you excrete it.Back to that cattle pasture you talk about about ? I doubt it.
Again do google search 'Asian women breat cancer soy'.I or others could go on ands on about the feedlot cattle and the amount of phosphate potassium and water it takes to produce them which is the only way the masses can temporarily haver the questionable diet you recommend.And don't put incorect words in my mouth about Asians only eating soy beans
like for some reason I am unaware of that simple logiical fact.
I've said all I want about this and end my contribution to it here and now.
At least Panetta is now excreting his worthless brain out,(25% of phosphate consumed by the human body like 25% of human calories consumed is to maintain the often useless or dangerous human brain),in the Chersapeak waterway as you can see from link below .

CIA and Berkely High School Motto:

'You shall Know the truth and the truth shall make you flee'
And where ever you flee you or there I mean here

http://www.cjr.org/the_audit/bloombergs_lobs_explosive_nake.php



Bloomberg’s Naked-Short Story Shows Stretch Marks
By Ryan Chittum


Tony

Your avoidance of Global Warming and Genocide in the Sudan clearly tells me that the two are closely linked, and your gang is in favor of it! Not sure of your TRUE p[osition on Md Blue Crab from your lack of responce, but must assume you are deeply involved in a Crab Conspiracy. Shame on you.

IAN

Posted by IndictAltomareNow on Mon 30 Mar 2009 at 06:17 PM




So like my former Congressman and your present CIA Chief Leon Panetta much of the problem that appears to concern you,(i.e.-destruction of blue crab environment and thus the blue crab),
is because you are full of shit and like my former congressman and now American 'intelligence' chief who now holds a positionm Al Capone would envy,you are full of shit and refuse to acknowledge are take responsibility for that fact.!
Below I have quote and link from a Scientific American article(that misspelled plants and wrote 'treatment plans' instead...So makes me feel better about all my typos over time and the abilty of those who are really interested in what I'm saying to do logical deductions.....
And in all this is the answer as to why the pope of today is as confused about atoms(the catholic church taught Aristote's 'four elements' after getting the Greek writings from the Araba in the 13th century snd translating them to Latin),movement through himself and his parishioners and the answer to thwe dilemma of why the movement of atoms and awareness thereof is more important that whether the sun moves around the earth or vice versa - the controversy in Galileo's time....And although you seem to be two nickles short of a dime in terms of your grasp of simple issues or because playing dumb is generally the modus operendi of stock scamsters Leon Panntta's and his pope's
phosphate dilemma is also your dilemma.:


http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=development-takes-toll-on


On its journey to the Chesapeake, water from Sligo Creek mingles with runoff from farms and sewage treatment plans.

Nitrogen and phosphorus in that runoff feed massive algae blooms that suck oxygen out of the water each summer, killing clams and worms that provide the blue crab with food and aquatic grasses that give it shelter.

Last year, the "dead zone" covered 40 percent of the Bay.
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Tony Ryals



Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 1:06 pm    Post subject: Glen Campbell - Good Riddance Reply with quote

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPpJT3QRRnk
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Tony Ryals



Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 1:16 pm    Post subject: we are dependent on the laws of biophysics Reply with quote

we're not digits
we're not widgits
we are dependent on the laws of biophysics
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Tony Ryals



Joined: 10 Jun 2010
Posts: 63

PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 2:27 pm    Post subject: In Praise of the Lard Reply with quote

I was thinking 'In Praise of the Lard' might have been the most approriate title for this thread particularly in light of the christian fundie Jones University grad you site to lend 'credibility'.However in certain circumstances as Farley Mowat writes in People of the Deer' the lard works wonders.

http://ryan-koch.blogspot.com/2009/10/farley-mowat-people-of-deer.html

In Praise of the Lard

While the book contains many fascinating tidbits, among the most intriguing are Mowat's detailed descriptions of the traditional Ilhalmiut diet and their shifting health as a result of Western influence. When he first arrives at the small settlement of Ilhalmiut, the author is welcomed with a tray of meat that might make any Westerner's stomach churn:


Half a dozen parboiled legs of deer were spread out in a thick gravy which seemed to be composed of equal parts of fat and deer hairs. Bobbing about in the debris were a dozen tongues and, like a cage holding the lesser cuts of meats, there was an entire rib basket of a deer. .....

What could be the instigator of such an unfortunate circumstance? Ol' Farley doesn't mince words:



Starvation first came to them when they began to subsist on a winter diet which now consists of 80 percent white flour, with a very little lard and baking powder, and in summer almost nothing but straight fish. The Idthen people now get little of the red meat and white fat of the deer, once their sole food. Three generations have been born and lived -- or died -- upon a diet of flour bannocks and fish eaten three times a day and washed down with tea. Each of these generations has been weaker and had less "immunity" to disease than the last. (p. 93)

.........
However on another note I was just reading the local Prensa Libre newspaper and found an estimation that 3 billion or so people still use wood to cook their meals.That's a lot of wood.
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arkestra



Joined: 05 Feb 2007
Posts: 273
Location: The Forest.

PostPosted: Sun Jul 03, 2011 12:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Novak Djokovic has just slaughtered Nadal becoming
the new wimbledon champion after an extraordinary
year of trailblazing.

Guess what he attributes this next level of success to?

Yes, a gluten free diet and the sports world are very
fascinated by this. This is big in terms of a shift because
already many mainstream articles are talking about the
nutritional benefits of the diet even if you dont test as
alllergic. Already there is talk of other tennis players
getting themselves tested and switching to a GF diet.


Quote:
SERBIAN TENNIS PLAYER Novak Djokovic beat Rafael Nadal this weekend for his 39th straight match victory and his seventh tournament title of 2011, nearly one-third of his career total.

His 37 straight wins to start the year is the best in nearly two decades and he has now beaten the world’s No. 1-ranked player (Nadal) four straight times, including twice on clay, Nadal’s strongest surface.

For years, Djokovic has been a great, but not dominating player and has struggled against bigger superstars Nadal and Roger Federer. Now, as the French Open nears, he’s suddenly the best player in the sport – the best it has seen in years.

So what happened? Gluten.

According to the Wall Street Journal, Djokovic learned last year that he has a gluten allergy. So he completely cut it out of his diet. So pasta, beer, cookies, cereal, or even Twizzlers.

Now he’s not just five pounds lighter and a step quicker, he’s dominating. He won his first major in January and beat Nadal twice in two weeks without giving up a set. If he reaches the French Open final, he’ll break John McEnroe’s record for victories to start a season.

But is it really just diet? Maybe. One nutritionist says that those who have allergies and give up gluten see tremendous benefits, but that those benefits are mostly mental, not physical.

And in a sport where endurance and focus often the make all the difference, a clear mind is the difference between a Grand Slam and being an also ran.

So if you’ve got a tennis prodigy at home, start reading the labels on those snack packs.


http://thescore.thejournal.ie/did-a-gluten-free-diet-make-novak-djokovic-the-best-tennis-player-in-the-world-138515-May2011/

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bri



Joined: 16 Jun 2006
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Location: Capacious Creek

PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2011 4:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anyone been on dogtorj.com lately?

The site looks awesome now.
There's also some new articles,
With lots more to come.
Dig in...

www.dogtorj.com
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