FAQ   Search   Memberlist   Usergroups   Register   Profile   Log in to check your private messages   Log in 
Audio: How Psychopaths Run Our Lives
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Next Level Forum Index -> General Discussion
  ::  Previous topic :: Next topic  
Author Message
Robert



Joined: 07 Feb 2006
Posts: 410

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
As for Icke, taking the term 'reptile brain' and taking it into space with his saying that the pathocratic are actually reptile, an alien race from Sirius or wherever is absurd. Disinfo spin.


I don't disagree with your opinion..but i'm not too sure Icke is so finalised on his take.....

Being fixed about someone else.....is not thinking lizard like how one could take advantage of their abilities.

This is George and the Dragon of course.....dudes it was 23rd.


Smile

Robert
Mr. Green
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Fintan
Site Admin


Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 8608

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:22 am    Post subject: Speaking of.... Reply with quote

Speaking of networks of psychopaths....

Click to view the full graphic here:
http://breakfornews.com/bfn1/theyrule.gif

http://theyrule.net
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
kathy



Joined: 20 Jan 2006
Posts: 728
Location: Surfing The Waves

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 8:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have posted before about M. Scott. Peck, author of books such as "The Road Less Traveled", "The Different Drum", "A World Waiting to be Born", "Denial of the Soul", "In Search of Stones" and "The People of The Lie", to name but a few of his books.


Quote:
M. Scott. Peck - On Psychiatric Illness

"Starting with the Road Less Traveled, perhaps the most radical thing that I
said in that book that deviated from traditional psychiatry is that I located
the source of psychiatric ills in the conscious mind, rather than the
unconscious.

And that the previous view, the Freudian sort of view, had been that the
unconscious was filled with all these bad feelings
, and angry thoughts,
sexy thoughts, and whatnot. And that was where psychiatric, psychological
illness originated. When in fact, the real question is why those things, which
were obvious, were in the unconscious, rather than the conscious mind.
The answer was that it was a conscious mind that didn’t want to face
certain truths
, and pushed this stuff into the unconscious.


But the problem is with a rejecting consciousness in which we simply don’t
like to think about things….

Over the years I came to believe, and again I’m leaving out the
biological aspects, but that psychological disorders are all disorders of
thinking. So narcissists, for instance, cannot or will not think of other
people….

What we used to call passive-dependent people don’t think for
themselves. Obsessive-compulsives tend to have great difficulty
thinking in the big picture.


And I would say that if you have a patient or a client who has some real
difficulty, psychological difficulty, look for the problem in their thinking.
There is some area where they are not thinking correctly. "
http://www.mscottpeck.com/html/conversations.html

_________________
IMAGINE
Truth fears no questions


Last edited by kathy on Sun Apr 29, 2007 3:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Jeroen



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 3:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
DrewTerry: His ideas about leaders being psychopaths are not revelatory or ground-breaking ideas. Perhaps because they are old ideas repackaged in a new form with new terms and phrases they seem to hold promise. However, is that not one of the oldest tricks? By regarding the current phenomenon as something new, and by dissociating history from the present using new words to describe old, we lose the benefit available to us in studying history to learn about today.

It's not just about the leaders but about society as a whole. Orwell's 1984 is a ponerological study. So is Kubrick's "Eyes wide shut". A comparison of both works would be an interesting ponerological exercise.
Quote:
DrewTerry: Narcissists, just like our elite, are scared little kids running around with a big bat, hitting over the head anyone they perceive as a threat. The only thing that keeps them going is the fear people have over what they might do next.

This is not a description of a "scared little kid":
Quote:
You are not held back from any of your desires by guilt or shame, and you are never confronted by others for your cold-bloodedness. The ice water in your veins is so bizarre, so completely outside of their personal experience, that they seldom even guess at your condition.
http://www.cassiopaea.org/cass/political_ponerology_lobaczewski.htm

Quote:
just0: If evil could be explained within a purely logical framework, it would have long since been accomplished and would no longer be a problem. [...] Personally, I feel that logic itself is what is holding us back, Fintan referred to the movie terminator in the audio, and it's the machine that represents the logical and unfeeling side, it's the logic within the matrix itself.

The theory of relativity can be explained within a purely logical framework, but the problem with it is that not many people can understand it. I think the most important thing to understand about our leaders is that they rule the world as if playing a game. Another thing that should be understood is the joy of being a perpetrator. This joy is comparable to the effect of acting out your frustrations. Think of the times you told someone to go fuck him/herself. The more impressed your victim was, the better you felt. If you cannot perceive yourself as a perpetrator, you are a child. As for logic and feelings, every feeling that you value can be used against you. That's why it is important to try to think logically.
Quote:
Ormond: The missing factor, is where does human empathy lie in the brain? This to date seems not to be known for certain. It's been called the 'ghost in the machine'.

That sounds a bit too mechanical to leave uncriticized. A bacterium is alive, but does not have a nervous system. Each cell in our body can be thought of as a lifeform. Therefore, the body is not a "machine" and the "ghost" is in every cell.
Quote:
Peck: The answer was that it was a conscious mind that didn’t want to face certain truths, and pushed this stuff into the unconscious. [...] Over the years I came to believe, and again I’m leaving out the biological aspects, but that psychological disorders are all disorders of thinking.

Whether it's the conscious mind pushing or the unconscious withholding is a meaningless dispute. The important thing is that the contents of the conscious mind are a function of the needs of its owner. If someone has a psychological problem, changing that function may help; it may be better to "face a truth" than to ignore it.
Quote:
Peck: So narcissists, for instance, cannot or will not think of other people….

This sounds like the opinion of someone without empathy and incapable of enjoying others as playmates.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kathy



Joined: 20 Jan 2006
Posts: 728
Location: Surfing The Waves

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
This sounds like the opinion of someone without empathy and incapable of enjoying others as playmates.


Do you mean "playmate" as in cat and mouse? Shocked

The important thing in what Peck say's, if he is right, is that the ruthless bastards who are screwing us over are not doing it for reasons buried in their un-conscious - they are very conscious of what they are doing, but choose to lie to themselves and everyone else about it all.

_________________
IMAGINE
Truth fears no questions
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
just0



Joined: 22 Jan 2006
Posts: 679

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 5:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Jeroen,

I shouldn't have said "feelings" in my original post because it wasn't my
intention to counterpoint logic with feeling. Also, some words have
different meanings for different people, so my posts end up being
perceived as a bit 'wishy washy' from time to time, it's a consequence
of trying to have a broad outlook on the situation.

Maybe I should re-state it another way; Intelligence is like a machine
that is 'unconscious' and can act rationally and logically without fail.
But without someone at the 'helm', making ethical and conscious decisions,
the machine becomes a pathological monster.

So really, the logical side would represent unconscious mechanistic drives,
while the conscious side does what it feels to be (ethically) the right
thing, incidentally the right thing is irrational.

Without getting too much into far-out metaphysics, It isn't difficult to
see that this pathological nature is present throughout society and therefore is
reflected in each of us (as most of us are born into some kind of patho-culture).

So there's a challenge there for all of us to overcome, it's not a case of simply
fighting the PTB.

And while I agree it's important to think logically and intelligently as opposed
to thinking emotionally or in a reactionary way, the point I'm trying to make
is, that you can't fight fire with fire. I'm not proposing a new-agey apathetic
doctrine, I'm trying to focus in on what I see as a major 'malfunction'.These
people are cunning and very intelligent and in this society, intelligence is king,
but what if intelligence is not all that it's cracked up to be, what if intelligence
is a tool - like the computer- in other words, what if the emperor wears no clothes
.....maybe that goes for us too Wink


Kathy, I like this Peck guy's take on things and I think it shows that
what we percieve to be unconcious drives might be just the opposite.

It could be something like this,
Intelligence without ethics is asleep. A brain on autopilot
Intelligence with ethics is awake. A brain with a driver.

_________________
~"“True observation begins when devoid of set patterns, and freedom of expression occurs when one is beyond systems.”"~
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Jeroen



Joined: 17 Jun 2006
Posts: 60

PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2007 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Kathy: Do you mean "playmate" as in cat and mouse?

No no, actually I was looking for a word that would exclude that meaning. I mean someone with whom you can have a good time and who can have a good time with you.
Quote:
Kathy: The important thing in what Peck say's, if he is right, is that the rootless bastards who are screwing us over are not doing it for reasons buried in their un-conscious - they are very conscious of what they are doing, but choose to lie to themselves and everyone else about it all.

Only in an Orwellian sense can someone be conscious of what he/she does and also lie to him/herself--in any other sense it is mutually exclusive. Peck would say that our leaders are "not thinking correctly". But what would be incorrect about their thinking? That their victims are not subhuman? That social darwinism is an incorrect doctrine? I'd say that what they think is a function of their needs; the desire to kick others in the face and the need to legitimize that. Their problem, in my view, lies in their needs, although I suppose it's possible to consider it "incorrect thinking".
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Logoagogo



Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've been reading a fair bit of the other material on the cassiopeaea.org website and there's some thought-provoking information also regarding hyper-dimensional reality and so on.

Thanks for the link, Ormond, and for a great show. Macro-social Ponerology is an intriguing concept and possibly an explanation why some of us get so royally screwed over in our lives by others who couldn't care less.

I have relatives who work in mental health in the UK-one of the country's top psychotherapeutic counsellors plus an uncle who worked in the field for 25 years, both extremely well experienced with pysychopaths. So I casually dropped that Dubya was psychopathic and he was 'well, of course'. I took it further, saying psychopathology is the only explanation for Tony Blair. And he said 'Well, you know, I wouldn't go that far'... (but then, he does subscribe to The Times)

So what is His Toniness? Spellcaster or something?

Anyway, great stuff guys.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Ormond



Joined: 14 Apr 2006
Posts: 1556
Location: Belly of the Beast, Texas

PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2007 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
I have relatives who work in mental health in the UK-one of the country's top psychotherapeutic counsellors plus an uncle who worked in the field for 25 years, both extremely well experienced with pysychopaths. So I casually dropped that Dubya was psychopathic and he was 'well, of course'. I took it further, saying psychopathology is the only explanation for Tony Blair. And he said 'Well, you know, I wouldn't go that far'... (but then, he does subscribe to The Times)


I've known people in the field here employed by the state who'd be careful not to give their professional opinion on our politicians too...can put the job at risk! Blair's finally stepping down from his role so ask him again in six months!
From here I can't imagine how anyone could miss that both Bush and Blair have deep psychological issues. Dress them in togas and laurel wreaths and they'd be well suited to play any of the decadent Roman Emperors.

Adolf Hitler only went down in the history books as a psychopath because he lost. As a matter of fact the Third Reich makes such an excellent documented study of how pathocracies work, because the historians were free to publish all of the secrets of their government operations and personal lives down to their pathological descriptions.
The United States government has at one time or another in it's history engaged in policies and military actions--and genocides--equal to any Nazi atrocity. Slave labor, concentration camps, and outright genocide.
In the US eras of overt pathocracy have run in a 70 year cycle. People get sick of them and their laws are overturned or amended. The length of the cycle has to do with how many years it takes for those who remembered and recognize the previous flare-up of psychopathic government to die off so a new generation is slow on the uptake to recognize them gradually taking power to themselves again.

This is the cycle that - when we 'win' this one by preventing this 'new world order' - must be broken.

A 'global village' isn't entirely their creation. Travel possibility and instant communication and enlightenment have been happening anyway. The question is only whether the present and future belongs to humanity or is co-opted by the G-8, (or as I call them, the 'United Snakes')

_________________
The anticipated never happens. The unexpected constantly occurs
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Logoagogo



Joined: 04 Oct 2006
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2007 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, sorry Ormond- I wasn't entirely clear in my writing. Blame it on being 'tired and emotional'.

My uncle is the one who wouldn't necessarily agree that Blair is a psychopath. He worked as a senior staff nurse in one of the UK's regional secure units, so his personal experience of psychopaths are the ones who torture children and such. He is now retired.

My cousin also worked as this before moving into psychotherapeutic counselling, a field he is proving very effective in.

In fact I just got off the phone to him, so can report his views.

In his opinion, Blair is a major psychopath with a narcissistic personality disorder. Bush has some kind of multiple personality disorder, possible as a result of trauma-based programming, but is also psychopathic.

The results of having psychopaths in positions of power is that their values trickle down and infect society, resulting in a culture of bullying, deception and so on. Those that are able to learn from this and function like psychopaths will succeed, those that can't may possibly end up in therapy for anxiety and depression.

But it seems more and more people are realising that this is a sick system and are rejecting the programming. But to do this successfully, you need to have the critical tools to understand what has happened and why before you can change it. And this holds true for societies as well as individuals.

Personally, from the sections of 'Political Ponerology' I have read (and i will be ordering a hard copy), it is an excellent work that goes to the heart of the psychopathy of power. Perhaps it is a little dry for the general reader, though.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Don Smith



Joined: 02 Feb 2007
Posts: 248
Location: Erehwon

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2007 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alice Miller's work on abuse in childhood has sent me in the direction of regarding our society as one of terror and pain, and it is so common that it is regarded as "normal".
Where I live in the Puget sound basin is a vast collection of military bases, most people that I see at work do not give it a thought, as the economy of the area is linked to great federal spending on the navy, has been for more than a century.
I had one of my in-laws in the car with me as we drove around the bay, a great many old ships were anchored there, awaiting destruction or whatever. My companion, in a moment of patriotic fervor, commented on the great sight of America's "freedom " being defended by the military, our brave boys and such crap.
I could not remain silent. I said that these great, gray engines of death were a theft from the people of the world, and they were like the Nazi ovens, only mobile.
My companion is now convinced of my mental instability, and I am kicking myself for pissing into a high wind, (again).

http://www.alice-miller.com/index_en.php

_________________
"A bayonet is a tool with a worker on both ends."- V.I.Lenin
Patriotism is a manifestation of the Stockholm Syndrome.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Fintan
Site Admin


Joined: 18 Jan 2006
Posts: 8608

PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2007 3:36 pm    Post subject: ! Reply with quote

ROTFLMAO !

Yeah, I can empathise with your feelings.
But it is very important to speak out as you did.

What I have found is that even though the emotional-ego mind of your
in-law reacted in a negative way, nevertheless the inner self of any person
hears every word you say and evaluates and recognizes the truth of it.

What happens then is that the inner-self-mind initiates a process of change
by attracting life-experiences designed to bring home a recognition of the
truth of things to the ego-mind. Sometimes these attracted experiences
are painful, but they do induce wisdom.

But none of this happens unless you speak out.

Try to ignore the ego-mind's reaction and just keep those planting seeds of change. Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    The Next Level Forum Index -> General Discussion All times are GMT - 5 Hours
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next
Page 2 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group

Theme xand created by spleen.